LED Lighting Question

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Jeff W

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I am researching LED solutions for my facility. I am looking for Parking lot lighting (Existing 400w MH) and sidewalk lighting (Existing 175w MH). Does anyone have experience with LED lighting that can point me in the right direction? Any good or bad experiences with LEDs.
 
Jeff W said:
I am researching LED solutions for my facility. I am looking for Parking lot lighting (Existing 400w MH) and sidewalk lighting (Existing 175w MH). Does anyone have experience with LED lighting that can point me in the right direction? Any good or bad experiences with LEDs.
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IMHO, LED technology is not yet ready to replace 175 or 400 watt MH, at an economic cost.
LED streetlights certainly exist but are not yet mainstream established technology.
LED technology is improving rapidly and may eventually replace other sources for street lighting, but at present MH or high power compact flouresecent seem to be a better choice.

If the existing lighting is in working order, then it might be best to wait a year or two before reviewing the matter.
If you have any defective fixtures, then it might be worth trying one or two LED units so as to assess suitability.

The very best LEDs are more efficient than MH, and being directional can place the light exactly where required. The lifetime of an LED SHOULD be much longer than MH but this is not allways achieved in practice.
 
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090325-0715 EST

I used the search string --- city of ann arbor led lighting --- in Google.

Then I found
http://www.a2dda.org/dda_achievements/led_street_lights/

And from there this one is probably the most useful. Go to the following site and probably ignore anything else.
http://www.a2gov.org/government/publicservices/systems_planning/energy/Documents/LED_Summary.pdf

I can not tell you my opinion of these lights because I avoid downtown. However, I now need to check these out. We have a very liberal city government and some things they do I agree with, others I do not.

There was not much real quantitative data in the above discussion, but certainly enough to be of some use. The references and what manufacturers were selected should be quite valuable as a starting point for your research.

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You might be able to use the LED fixture for pedestrian lighting but I also don't think it's ready yet for parking lot or street lighting. But really, really close. If you're willing to pay.

This is the best line of LED site lighting products I've seen so far. Complete with IES files and everything. I think they're inflating the energy saving claims vs HID. http://betaled.com/products.aspx

Here's a study the DOE did comparing LED street lights.
http://www1.eere.energy.gov/buildings/ssl/news_detail.html?news_id=12214
 
Jeff W said:
I am researching LED solutions for my facility. I am looking for Parking lot lighting (Existing 400w MH) and sidewalk lighting (Existing 175w MH). Does anyone have experience with LED lighting that can point me in the right direction? Any good or bad experiences with LEDs.
Click to expand...


Led is quite expensive but there are many good products out there by Cree

Another possiblility is a high watt self ballasted compact fluorescent to replace the MH bulbs. They come in wattages up to 105 watts - not sure of its equivalent in MH. Here is a link Eiko.

The problem I see with this is you have to disconnect the ballast thus running into potential UL listing issues.

Cree makes LED tubes that replaces the 4' tube fluorescents but again you must disconnect the ballast. Cree says it is fine but what does UL say????
 
Thanks for all the information, links and oppinions. It looks like my journey into LED lighting solutions is just beginning.

gar...Thanks for the link to Ann Arbor (good read). I have been looking around the internet for LED vendors and manufacturers and have found case study after case study that keeps going back to you guys. Looks like Ann Arbor is poineering the "Green City" effort. If you happen to drive through, let me know what you think.
 
090325-2015 EST

Jeff:

I did a drive around tonight.

Our downtown Main Street with globe LED lights looked satisfactory from the car.

"The City of Ann Arbor is also testing several different varieties of what are called "cobrahead" fixtures on Glendale Dr (example to the left). " from
http://www.a2dda.org/dda_achievements/led_street_lights/
The existing poles were used and the previous lights were simply replaced with the LEDs. Just below the fixture it is probably brighter than the previous light, but between poles I am sure the intensity is less.

At my home I have a corner lot and a light on the corner. It is proably 250 to 300 ft to the next light. I consider the illumination between these two lights to be satisfactory. If these were replaced with LED units I believe the midpoint illumination would be less than satisfactory.

Also I think our current lamp life on average is greater than 5 years. It is very seldom I have notify the city that our street light is burned out. Any time we have a lamp burn out I am aware of the problem because the city does not know a light is out until you call them.

.
 
Interesting topic

Interesting topic

I too was curious and appreciate the links.
I'll have to check out the lights next time I'm on that side of the state.

My curiosity about life-cycle remains. Especially in the rigors of Michigan's outdoors. I assume the LEDs would fair better from the results of vibration and cold starts, but I'm curious about the heat of the summer sun and electrical storms? With the significantly higher replacement cost they NEED to last longer to be cost effective.

I too agree that the current MH fixtures I've seen around (City of GR) do seem to do far better than two years. I'm pretty sure that at my last house, in the 8 years I lived there, 1 fixture on the block was serviced.

I guess I'm lucky enough to take a wait and see approach.

Thanks,
Doug S.
 
090326-1024 EST

Talked to the city and got some new information.

My neighborhood has high pressure sodium and their average life is about 4 years. The reason I have not seen burn outs often is because these are automatically replaced by Detroit Edison on a rotating basis. The old mercury vapor lights, which are now banned, did have 10 year lifetimes.

The latest residential street lights, samples of which are not installed yet, do have much better side illumination. There is a section in our town, close to me, where these newer residential lights will be installed. Supposedly these will be much better than in the Glendale experimental area.

Technical data on light intensity vs side offset from the lamp and I believe other data is being prepared for presentation on the Internet. Not sure when it will be available.

.
 
Side illumination is going to be very important. My pole lights are approximately 200ft apart in each row. The next row is staggered putting a pole light approximately every 100ft apart. Similar to a checker board pattern.

I am in the process of contacting multiple LED vendors and requesting dispersion patterns with associated fc readings based on my situation. 30ft poles and the pole pattern.

I very curious to see what type of responses I get back. I have been doing a lot of reading lately on this subject and the most obvious thing that has become apperant to me is that I have a lot more research to do.

Thanks to everyone for the feedback.
 
090327-1943 EST

Jeff:

What is the spacing between rows? Today at my home I determined the pole spacing to be about 270 ft. No lights on the opposite side of the street. Our pavement is 60 ft wide and I would expect your row spacing to be closer to 100 ft.

With rows 100 ft apart, poles in a row 200 ft apart, and lights offset by 100 ft in adjacent rows I would judge from what I saw that LED lighting might be moderately good.

.
 
gar,

My light pattern is like this:


Row 1 @ 200ft @ 200ft @ 200ft @


Row 2 @ 200ft @ 200ft @ 200ft @


Row 3 @ 200ft @ 200ft @ 200ft @

The distance between the rows is 60ft. I measured diagonally from the first light in Row 1 to the first light in Row 2 it was 140ft. I have contacted vendor Lumecon and sent them an CAD drawing of my parking lot. They have agreed to provide a Photometric layout utilizing their LED pole light. I hope to have the results next week.
 
gar,

The lay out did not maintain the configuration when the post was submitted. Row 2 should be offset to the right to center the first light between the first and second light of Rows 1 and 3.


Row 1 @ 200ft @ 200ft @

Row 2 light @ 200ft @

Row 3 @ 200ft @ 200ft @
 
090327-2308 EST

Jeff:

I get 116.61 ft diagonally between lights in two adjacent rows using a right triangle of 100 x 60. This is very close to the distance between lights two rows apart. If you draw circles 120 feet in diameter there are only small spots not covered.

.
 
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