legal question

[tonyou812]

About 3 weeks ago I got a call to go and move a service from one side of the house to another.The panel was inside a kitchen cabinet and it needed to be rectified so the home could be sold. It was inspected before the sale and the owners were told that the panel had to be moved. Plus they wanted it upgraded from 100- 200 amps. So I go look at it and give them a price. They tell me its too much and they have someone that will do it for less.
Fine by me because I dont work for free. So today I get a call from the same people and they tell me that the person that they had hired didnt complete the work properly and that it failed inspection ( they needed it to pass so they could close on the home)And they wanted to know if I would be interested in finishing the job right? If I wasnt kind of hurting for work I would tell them to " kiss my gritts" but I could use the cash. What would I need to do? Refile for a permit for moving a service plus upgrade.

 

[480sparky]

Add 25% to your original price.

 

[ultramegabob]

Add 25% to your original price.

I would go look at what mess they made first, 25% may not be enough...

 

[ceb58]

What would I need to do? Refile for a permit for moving a service plus upgrade

Yes and then make sure it cost more to do it right the second time. You have no idea what some one else has done and what it will take to correct the problems.

 

[dwellselectric]

I would have them sign a contract also so they dont try to screw you on your money

 

[Dennis Alwon]

That a hard one Tony because you don't know if the original contractor wasn't getting paid. I suspect it wasn't more than a days work so I am not sure that payment was the problem.

If you have to get inspected I would talk to the inspections depart. Around here I would just get the paperwork moved to my name. Be careful and make sure you want the other guys work on your permit.

 

[wbalsam1]

Tell them to keep looking. They didn't give a damn about your skills when they had a way to cheap out....but, now they want the job done right and I'll lay you odds that it won't turn out the way you planned it the first time.

 

[tmbrk]

I ran into a similar situation last year. I bid on a finished basement (nothing was said about a 200-amp upgrade). About two months go by and they call me to say they would like me to come back out because they had made some changes to the original plans. When I got there the woman told me they had gone with another electrician (no permit was aquired) and that besides the finished basement he was to do a 200-amp service upgrade. She explained that she would like me to finish it (grounding rod, ground to water pipe). It looked basically finished (temp connections into POCO conductors) except for the grounding system. I told her we needed a permit and that I would need to check everything and there would be an extra fee. She then told me they had given a large deposit to the other electrician and now could not get ahold of him and had heard he had gotten a DUI. SHE THEN ASKED ME TO FINISH AND INSPECT THE SERVICE AND COMPLETE THE BASEMENT FINISH AT A LOWER PRICE THAN I ORIGINALLY GAVE THEM (for only the finished basement) because they had given the other guy a bunch of their money and didn't have enough to pay me.

The thing that really made me mad is that this was the second trip that I made out there already. What a waste of time.

Edited to add: The other electrician had not started any work on the basement finish yet.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

It sounds like someone is going to have to do the work, so...

1. find out the first EC's phone number to discover if he is being paid, and that the issue is not he "failed" inspection. Always, always give the other EC the consideration when being asked to follow another EC.

2. If you find out the call by the customer is legitimate, then discuss over the phone before you go waste any of your time that the cost may be more than discussed earlier, as there may be some remediation adding to the cost. If they are not happy with that discussion, say thank you and go on your way.

3. If they decide that you are to do the work, ask for at least 50% of the total cost to sign the contract, with the balance due the day of completion of the contract work (I hope you have a contract signed before you start the work).
File the job and good luck!

 

[ultramegabob]

It sounds like someone is going to have to do the work, so...

1. find out the first EC's phone number to discover if he is being paid, and that the issue is not he "failed" inspection. Always, always give the other EC the consideration when being asked to follow another EC.

2. If you find out the call by the customer is legitimate, then discuss over the phone before you go waste any of your time that the cost may be more than discussed earlier, as there may be some remediation adding to the cost. If they are not happy with that discussion, say thank you and go on your way.

3. If they decide that you are to do the work, ask for at least 50% of the total cost to sign the contract, with the balance due the day of completion of the contract work (I hope you have a contract signed before you start the work).
File the job and good luck!

Solid advice.

 

[infinity]

I wouldn't touch it even for more money than you had originally bid. That's just me. They got what they paid for and now they can possibly lose the sale because of it. I'd tell them sorry and hope they learned a valuable lesson for the next time.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

I wouldn't touch it even for more money than you had originally bid. That's just me. They got what they paid for and now they can possibly lose the sale because of it. I'd tell them sorry and hope they learned a valuable lesson for the next time.

Rob
Are you in business to teach people a good lesson?

When I have a business decision to make, I try to make it with as clear a head as the moment will allow. I understand there are moments where that is more difficult. But it is those difficult moments when one is able to make good business decisions that define his/her future.


As I mentioned, someone is going to do the work, why not you for the right price? Would that alone not be giving them a good lesson?

 

[480sparky]

I wouldn't touch it even for more money than you had originally bid. That's just me. They got what they paid for and now they can possibly lose the sale because of it. I'd tell them sorry and hope they learned a valuable lesson for the next time.

I've been down the same path as the OP, and ended up not only getting the job (despite the fact that my price went up), but I ended up with some bucks in my pocket, one very happy HO, and an estactic realtor.

I am currently doing a kitchen-master bath-laundry-basement remodel/family room addition for this same HO now, and the realtor sends me work here and there.

 

[quogueelectric]

I hate cleaning up other peoples crap and I price accordingly.

 

[tonyou812]

Thanks peeps, I have people sign a proposal for any work above 500 bucks or if they just give me a weird vibe. I would like to make every customer sign a proposal but my fancy proposal sheets from nebs arent cheep. I really felt like telling them no thanks but the job is just a few miles away and I figured Ill go take a look. If it looks like I can make it worth my while why not? Im gonna charge them for the time I spend looking over the other dudes work too. Im gonna bang them good, they need the inspection more than I do.:wink:

 

[frizbeedog]

Thanks peeps, I have people sign a proposal for any work above 500 bucks or if they just give me a weird vibe. I would like to make every customer sign a proposal but my fancy proposal sheets from nebs arent cheep. I really felt like telling them no thanks but the job is just a few miles away and I figured Ill go take a look. If it looks like I can make it worth my while why not? Im gonna charge them for the time I spend looking over the other dudes work too. Im gonna bang them good, they need the inspection more than I do.:wink:

Do not feel bad. The homeowners choose who they want to work on their house.....and ultimately pay the price, as evidenced by the tale you just told. My philosophy, at this point, would be T&M. Once a person calls me and denies me for a cheaper price, I just don't care anymore. If they are calling me back for a repair, it's because they know they made they the mistake. It's all part of the educating the public that you get what you pay for. Sounds harsh, but I have no sympathy anymore for clients that do not value what electrical proffesionals bring to the table.

 

[infinity]

Rob
Are you in business to teach people a good lesson?

Nope, but taking on a job that is a potential nightmare because Mr. Low ball screwed it up is IMO more trouble than it's worth. However, if Tony really needs the money (he said so) then he's free to negotiate a better deal the second time around and take on any headaches that may arise due to what Mr. Low ball had already done.

For the EC it's a matter of economics and personal choice. The same two issues that got Mr. Low ball the job in the first place.

 

[cschmid]

I got involved in a job like this..I got my cash and the other electrician got trouble he also had a drinking problem that will wreck a business..Yet the ramifications can be worse than expected if the HO are well known..so it is double edge sword..just be careful and ask lots of questions and be nosey..it is your businesses reputation..

 

[wbalsam1]

I've been invited to the party so many times over the years where a cheapo homeowner has a hack wannabe "electrician" (no offense to real electricians) do the work and has it looked at by a hack wannabe "inspector" ( no offense to real ones) and then when they're both in trouble, call me. The walls are covered, the wiring enclosed...who knows what happened....bull. The building code has been in effect since 1984 in NYS and permits and inspections required since then. I'm not a custodian for hacks. If you're shopping for opinions and cheaping the job, when you call me it's "sorry, wrong number". You got what you deserved. I ain't a trades baby-sitter. Keep dialing. :smile:

 

[chris500]

If you are passing up work like this because you got your feelings hurt because they tried to save money in the first place. You probably need to go see a shrink or get some thicker skin.

Most people that aren't intertwined with construction, electricity, or plumbing in general only look at things from a cost perspective. They don't know up front about the problems they are getting into by hiring what we call a hack. They see that this company wanted 4k to do something that another one wanted 2k for. Easy choice for them at the time.

Check the job out, give em a price, if they take it great for you and your future. If not, don't burn a bridge simply because they found someone else to do the work. If you've been in business for any length of time, you realize that business in general is about the contacts you make, and continue to make over the years.