Light installed on mirror.

[Mick Allen]

Hello, My name is Mick.
Could someone please shed some light on the following situation?
I just finished re modeling a bathroom. There is a wall to wall mirror above the vanity with the light sitting on the mirror.
Glass guy installed the mirror and it broke when the electrician was installing the light.
Glass guy says it was the electricians fault and electrician says it was the glass guys fault.
Electrician used a 2" x 4" box (is this OK for a heavy light).
The mirror covered the 4 corners of the box as it was cut oval shaped (is this within code?).
Electrician says the box should have been fully exposed. Glass guy says the box should have been 4" and round.
I am not an electrician, can someone please tell me what is the code requirement for a Light fixture box in this situation? Please note, I did not make a penny either from the Electrical work or the Glass work. I am ready to pay for the glass out of my pocket to get this thing resolved.... Help!

 

[Dennis Alwon]

IMO, the box should be fully exposed. I have been in this situation where the mirror guy did not cut the glass enough to get the screws in straight. When my guys put the screws in at an angle the mirror cracked but many hours later. We ate it. It was a lesson for the boys as they should not have installed the light and when the do they need to use some rubber grommets so that the screws are not putting pressure on the mirror.

Good luck trying to decide who is at fault. Maybe they both can pay half

 

[iwire]

I do agree with Dennis in that the box should have been exposed

However, it is bad practice to cut square corners in glass. In my opinion the electrician should have used a round box.

It seems lack of experience or lack of communication was the issue and the cost should be split.

 

[K8MHZ]

I do agree with Dennis in that the box should have been exposed

However, it is bad practice to cut square corners in glass. In my opinion the electrician should have used a round box.

It seems lack of experience or lack of communication was the issue and the cost should be split.

Square inside corners will crack. It's not if, it's when. That's just the nature of glass.

 

[Little Bill]

Hello, My name is Mick.
Could someone please shed some light on the following situation?

Don't you already have enough people trying to "shed some light"?:lol:

Sorry, couldn't resist!
I agree it sounds like the glass guy and electrician were both at fault and should split the cost.

 

[Mick Allen]

Mick Allen

Mick Allen

I do indeed appreciate the feed back folks. Thank you all!
Last question, was it a code issue to use a 2x4 box for a 3 light fixture? Instead of a 4" round or square?
Thank you again!
Mick

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I do indeed appreciate the feed back folks. Thank you all!
Last question, was it a code issue to use a 2x4 box for a 3 light fixture? Instead of a 4" round or square?
Thank you again!
Mick

Here is the article that applies. IMO, a 2x4 box can be compliant if....

(1) Vertical Surface Outlets. Boxes used at luminaire or
lampholder outlets in or on a vertical surface shall be identified
and marked on the interior of the box to indicate the
maximum weight of the luminaire that is permitted to be
supported by the box if other than 23 kg (50 lb).
Exception: A vertically mounted luminaire or lampholder
weighing not more than 3 kg (6 lb) shall be permitted to be
supported on other boxes or plaster rings that are secured
to other boxes, provided that the luminaire or its supporting
yoke, or the lampholder, is secured to the box with no fewer
than two No. 6 or larger screws.

 

[Sierrasparky]

I do indeed appreciate the feed back folks. Thank you all!
Last question, was it a code issue to use a 2x4 box for a 3 light fixture? Instead of a 4" round or square?
Thank you again!
Mick

If the box is rated for a fixture then I would say yes.

 

[GerryB]

I do indeed appreciate the feed back folks. Thank you all!
Last question, was it a code issue to use a 2x4 box for a 3 light fixture? Instead of a 4" round or square?
Thank you again!
Mick

When you say 2x4 box do you mean a box normally used for a plug or switch? Those boxes have smaller screws than round fixture boxes and may not be rated for fixtures although they are used like that. (and probably ok for a 3-light fixture) I would say if the screw holes are completely clear of the glass you should be ok. If the screw rubs on the glass at all you have a problem. Also certain types of lights have mounting hardware designed by people who don't have to install them and some are very difficult to get a nice flush fit to the wall. Dealing with glass makes it that much harder. I also had a mirror crack, there were two lights on this mirror, I put the first on and while doing the second glanced over at the first and saw it had cracked. I had to pay, supposedly the glass guy gave me a break. IT'S ALWAYS THE ELECTRICIANS FAULT!, even if it's not. He was the last one there. If you are the homeowner then it's not your fault you shouldn't have to pay.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

You can still cut the box screws so you don't have pressure against the glass and still have rounded corners. We always use round boxes but the glass guys have no clue about what you need. When they cut holes for receptacles in glass we use spacers so the receptacle is not putting pressure on the glass. In fact the glass installers around here stock the ones made for this purpose.

 

[mgookin]

Glass guys eat glass all the time; it's the nature of their business. The stuff breaks.

The glass guy should know what he's installing against. If that box was there when he put his glass in he should eat the mistake. The electrician is not expected to know what the physical properties of glass is but the glass guy should know what the limits are.

Ask the glass guy what he wants; give him what he wants. Make him pay for the glass.

He should not have installed his glass in a bad installation even if he's going behind someone else's work.

 

[mirawho]

I am just surprised the electrician, if it was a remodel, used a handy box instead of a recessed 4S with a plaster ring or a 3/0 box. Handy boxes are really a pain to wire into, especially when you are attaching a cross bar to the top of it. They are great for a single switch or receptacle, bad for a wiring/fixture project. Why would one make so much grief for themselves?