Lighting contactor

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mannyb

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Electrician
If I were to install a lighting contactor inside a regular nema 1 enclosure would this be classified as UL listed or do I need to purhcase as an enclosure/lighting contactor combo?
 
You are constructing an Industrial Control Panel since it has more than one power/control circuit, so in order for it to be considered listed, a UL panel shop would need to build it (or I believe field inspect it).
 
EC Dan said:
You are constructing an Industrial Control Panel since it has more than one power/control circuit, so in order for it to be considered listed, a UL panel shop would need to build it (or I believe field inspect it).
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Why would a lighting contactor in a box constitute an industrial control panel?
 
EC Dan said:
You are constructing an Industrial Control Panel since it has more than one power/control circuit, so in order for it to be considered listed, a UL panel shop would need to build it (or I believe field inspect it).
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What if the control circuit is tapped from the power of the controlled circuit?
 
The enclosure would have the contactor and presumably a push button or selector switch, therefore it has the two or more components that qualify it as an ICP. I also consider a tap off the motor circuit for the coil to be a separate circuit. I'm with Larry though, I would do that without hesitation but I don't know what the OP's requirements are.

Edit: If the control circuit exits the enclosure and goes to a wall switch, then maybe that would not be considered an ICP.
 
the rules of your state may determine what’s allowed. In WA, we can build control panels if all the parts are UL listed and it’s inspected. Some control panel parts are componet recognized and can only be used by a panel shop.
IMO what you are building would be acceptable.
 
LarryFine said:
While the "assembly" may not be listed, I wouldn't let that stop me.
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''Assembly''was the word I was look for when I was writing my post. The GC has a 200a 3 pole contactor 120v coil mounted inside a 22'' x 38'' nema 4 enclosure. The enclosure takes up most of the space and takes up and area I need to place my equipment. I asked GC if I could purchase a smaller enclosure to install the contactor and he mentioned it wouldnt be UL listed. I asked him what made his box listed for contactor and he couldnt answer. So it made me think what makes this ''Assembly'' UL list? I have UL listed parts so why cant my Assembly be UL listed.
 
mannyb said:
''Assembly''was the word I was look for when I was writing my post. The GC has a 200a 3 pole contactor 120v coil mounted inside a 22'' x 38'' nema 4 enclosure. The enclosure takes up most of the space and takes up and area I need to place my equipment. I asked GC if I could purchase a smaller enclosure to install the contactor and he mentioned it wouldnt be UL listed. I asked him what made his box listed for contactor and he couldnt answer. So it made me think what makes this ''Assembly'' UL list? I have UL listed parts so why cant my Assembly be UL listed.
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If you are a UL 508A panel shop it can be listed. I don't personally see why it needs to be but if UL listing of the assembly is a requirement that is pretty much how it's going to have to be.

You could also have it assembled by someone who already has the UL 508A capability and he can put the sticker on it.

I think somebody else mentioned you can have it field evaluated as well, but that is a very expensive option.
 
mannyb said:
''Assembly''was the word I was look for when I was writing my post. The GC has a 200a 3 pole contactor 120v coil mounted inside a 22'' x 38'' nema 4 enclosure. The enclosure takes up most of the space and takes up and area I need to place my equipment. I asked GC if I could purchase a smaller enclosure to install the contactor and he mentioned it wouldnt be UL listed. I asked him what made his box listed for contactor and he couldnt answer. So it made me think what makes this ''Assembly'' UL list? I have UL listed parts so why cant my Assembly be UL listed.
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An "Industrial Control Panel" is defined as an assembly of two or more components.
1.3 This equipment consists of assemblies of two or more components, such as motor controllers,
overload relays, fused disconnect switches, circuit breakers, and related control devices such as
pushbuttons, pilot lights, selector switches, timers, control relays, and similar devices, with associated
wiring, terminal blocks, and similar components.
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You can have a Listed open style contactor and you can have a listed ENCLOSED contactor if listed by the manufactu8rer that way. But if you buy a listed open style contactor and put it in your own enclosure, that becomes an "Industrial Control Panel" that needs to be listed as such, because there are rules about enclosure size, wire bending space requirements, heat rise, short circuit current ratings, labeling etc. that must be followed. When the manufacturer puts together and sells an "enclosed" lighting contactor, they had to go through that process separately for the enclosed version even though the open version was already listed. Everyone must follow those rules.
 
What about using an empty enclosure made for contactors, and putting one in it?

1641545273387.png

Is that as good as getting one with a contactor already in it?

1641545360441.png

Is what appears to be putting a contactor in a generic contactor enclosure okay?

1641545563848.png

But doing it this way is out of the question?

1641545936561.png
 
I've purchased Hoffman boxes that have removable backplates for many jobs. I've never had an inspector question the validity or listing of any devices that I installed on the backplate. I've even put a 3pole 30A definite purpose contactor in an 8 x 8 screw cover J box to use a master switch to turn all the lights in a home before. May be wrong but I don't see any problem with it.
 
Rick 0920 said:
I've purchased Hoffman boxes that have removable backplates for many jobs. I've never had an inspector question the validity or listing of any devices that I installed on the backplate. I've even put a 3pole 30A definite purpose contactor in an 8 x 8 screw cover J box to use a master switch to turn all the lights in a home before. May be wrong but I don't see any problem with it.
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There is nothing wrong with it. UL has convinced the world that unless it's been blessed by their overlords, the world will burn to the ground. I've seen more than a few UL-stickered panels that came out of UL508A shops that were an absolute nightmare. Somehow, that was OK because the magic sticker make everything OK, but an electrician field installing a contactor in an enclosure is "bad." <rant/>


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