Lightning Strike

[p51]

I recently gave a repair estimate on a house that had been struck by lighting. The strike was direct and caused on estimated $20,000 in structual damage alone. The wiring in the house was 60 yrs. old cloth covered type romex, the wiring was burned in the attic and other exposed areas. I reccomended rewiring the whole house as there was no way to inspect let alone certify the condition of the wire in the walls. The insurance company agreed to this as long as the city electrical inspector agreed with my opinion. I met with the inspector and he agreed that all the wiring should be replaced but would not commit to that, he said that, he was not able to "make that call". I have been in this trade for 38 yrs. 25 of those as a contractor. Where does the inspector's (authority having jurisdiction) responsibility begin and end. All through my career I have been made to do things by the AHJ that I felt were not needed but did so to get my inspection. I have been made to open existing walls, Make repairs to existing wiring that had nothing to do with my work,etc.etc. Most of the NEC is based upon the "what if" factor as well as the "err on the side of caution", which I agree with in most cases. In this case the ins. co. only will pay for the obvious repairs which I feel is a life safety issue and will not take the job. Again, what is the responsibility of the AHJ?

 

[Sierrasparky]

I'm am sure you can get the local inspector to agree to it if you ask him " based on all the area's shown burned are you willing to sign of the home if I ( you the EC will not stand behind the concealed electrical. After all most Building inspectors want someone to sign off on the work like the EC in instances like this. I would take that approach.

 

[SEO]

Ask the electrical inspector what he requires to have replaced and tested (megged) before he will approve the job. The inspector has to sign his name on the inspection report so put the onus on him. Some inspection agencys require a complete rebuild if a certain percentage of the structure is destroyed. I can't speak for your inspector but the inspectors I know and myself included have the authority to make the call as we see fit.

 

[ceb58]

Insurance work I have done was on a home that had extensive smoke damage. The insurance company sent in their own Electrical Engineer to make a report of what would need to be done. In this case he recommended just replacing the recp. and switches. I didn't feel comfortable with it and ask the local AHJ to come look it over. After looking it over he said he would have to go with what the insurance company's EE recommendations. His reasoning was 1, the insurance co. had an licensed EE inspect the work and make recommendations 2, there were no rehabilitation codes in effect that would apply to this job.(no afci requirements at the time) 3, if he tried to override the ins. co. recommendations they could come back on the county for payment of repairs that their EE did not recommend.

 

[charlietuna]

Although the original wiring is old--it still conforms to the code within this juristiction or then it would be the inspector's job to have red tagged the installation before the lightning strike. You are asking the inspector to stick his neck out-to say the old installation is not repairable -- some jobs get hit by lightning without suffering any damage!! The insurance company realizes this and thats why they asked for a letter from the inspector. Such a letter places the municipality on the spot. It sets up a legal statement which could be challenged in court. Don't blame the inspector - he's doing his job!

 

[satcom]

the wiring was burned in the attic and other exposed areas. I reccomended rewiring the whole house as there was no way to inspect let alone certify the condition of the wire in the walls.

I can't believe the insurance company rejected your written professional proposal, and what gave ever gave the insurance company, the idea that the city has anything to do with repairs made. Your libality is on the line if anything happens to that home, I am sure there is something else wrong, if that is what the insurance company said.

 

[satcom]

the wiring was burned in the attic and other exposed areas. I reccomended rewiring the whole house as there was no way to inspect let alone certify the condition of the wire in the walls.

I can't believe the insurance company rejected your written professional proposal, and what gave ever gave the insurance company, the idea that the city has anything to do with repairs made. Your libality is on the line if anything happens to that home, I am sure there is something else wrong, if that is what the insurance company said.

 

[growler]

Don't blame the inspector - he's doing his job!

I agree with this and the city won't normally get involved with this type of work because there is no reason for them to.

They should at present have the property condemned. The meter should be removed and a building permit needed for the property because of structural damage.

Now the insurance company or the GC that's over the job can get estimates as to what it will take to put the electrical back in safe condition. Only an idiot is going to bid anything less than a total rewire because the inspections are going to be tough and there is the liability issue so it comes down to whoever can rewire it the cheapest.

They will need a new certificate of occupancy which means they can make you bring everything up to code so what choice is there but to rewire. Trying to use any of the old wiring is pretty much a waste of time in a situation like this.

 

[Pierre C Belarge]

Have the homeowner get, in writing, what the insurance company is willing to pay for.

Put your proposal in for rewiring the entire home, regardless of the insurance company's decision.

If you get the job, great, if not well in tough times like this, it is tough to turn work down, but the description of damage caused is enough to make a sensible EC walk away from potential law suits later...should an accident occur due to electric issues.

 

[Rewire]

does megging wires really accomplish anything? I megged a 5 ft piece of wire then I took a torch and almost completely burned off the coating in a 1 ft section after it cooled I megged it again and got the exact same reading as before.

 

[Sierrasparky]

Yea that seems correct a megger at 500 or 1000k will not show very much if the wire is dry and there is a gap between wires. Just think of a sparkplug gap. How much voltage will it take to jump the gap of a clean plug. Take a sooty carboned plug you will see a difference. Get it wet and see even less voltage to jump the gap. If you use a megger of too high a voltage you can ruin a perfectly good wire as the high voltage pulse needs to blow out somwhere.

So if a wire is clean but the insulation is melted or blown out and there is a gap it will megger fine. Is that something you would state your reputation on.

 

[growler]

I reccomended rewiring the whole house as there was no way to inspect let alone certify the condition of the wire in the walls.

After reading the original post again I think I see the mistake made by the EC when dealing with an insurance company.

Insurance on a home actually covers damages incurred due to an accident such as a lightning strike or fire.

When you tell them the house needs to be rewired they are not interested in this because the condition of the wiring is not their responsibility. It's not up to the insurance company to replace 60 year old wiring, only wiring damaged by lightning, that's what's covered.

So when you write up a report on a house with a lightning strike be sure to state that all the wiring was damaged due to said lightning strike ( if this is what you believe happened ). If the insurance company doesn't think the wiring was damaged then let them try to prove it, it really can't be done. No one can prove conclusively that the old wiring is only deteriated by age or sustained damage during the lightning strike, it's a matter of opinion.

 

[satcom]

After reading the original post again I think I see the mistake made by the EC when dealing with an insurance company.

Insurance on a home actually covers damages incurred due to an accident such as a lightning strike or fire.

When you tell them the house needs to be rewired they are not interested in this because the condition of the wiring is not their responsibility. It's not up to the insurance company to replace 60 year old wiring, only wiring damaged by lightning, that's what's covered.

So when you write up a report on a house with a lightning strike be sure to state that all the wiring was damaged due to said lightning strike ( if this is what you believe happened ). If the insurance company doesn't think the wiring was damaged then let them try to prove it, it really can't be done. No one can prove conclusively that the old wiring is only deteriated by age or sustained damage during the lightning strike, it's a matter of opinion.

I think this was the issue I was fishing for, but you addressed it well!