lights with metric screws that dont fit 8/32 holes

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bullheimer

bullheimer

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WA
lites are coming with these unusable screws more and more. In Oct 2014 EC&M Magazine. Mike Holt's Code Basics states on page 38 in paragraph headed Mounting snap switches, referring to using wood screws to mount switches...."Another bad, and probably more dangerous, practice is that of attaching luminares to boxes using screws that weren't designed, tested, and listed to support them. The NEC prohibits both of these practices."

I would like to know where that is. I would like to propose a change to the NEC that only allows 8/32's to mount standard light fixtures to standard boxes. (omits fan boxes)

I am sick and tired of these chinese fixtures coming with metric screws. I have brought this to the attention of the UL and they basically don't give a crap. So it will require a code change to do this unless the above wording my Mike can somehow be used to force the UL to take action. And if anybody has any ideas on what further action i could take with the UL, please let me know. I have sent them the screw kit that came with the light fixture but it seems like they would like a sample of each and every light fixture i want to pitch a bitch about.
 
Probably nobody is going to pay for your pitch time and the resulting medical bills from the resulting stress.

Adjust labor & material costs & replace with the appropriate screws. Then you will be at peace grasshopper.
 
mivey said:
Probably nobody is going to pay for your pitch time and the resulting medical bills from the resulting stress.

Adjust labor & material costs & replace with the appropriate screws. Then you will be at peace grasshopper.
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Yea what ever happened to the metric conversion in the US.
 
Sierrasparky said:
Yea what ever happened to the metric conversion in the US.
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The big major push, like highway signs, was almost 40 years ago, back in the Carter Administration.

Since that failure, it has been voluntary. In my opinion the last major industry hold out is the 'construction trades'. It seems not many people give a second thought to the amount of metric in food, electronics, and automotive items.
 
The only remaining nonmetric countries in the world are the United States, Liberia, and Myanmar (Burma).

Read more: Metric Holdouts http://www.infoplease.com/askeds/metric-holdouts.html#ixzz3TpQaQu2p.

Once you use metric, you don't want to go back to imperial.

And of course, the NEC is metric based.

However, I would suggest you make a proposal for a change to the 2020 NEC.
 
Bullheimer, UL only tests certain aspects of the fixture and do not really consider NEC rules.

I often trash those screws and tap the bar for 8x32 screws but the problem is when the screws get install so the threads are showing and a small cap is used. Those caps are not 8x32.
 
jim dungar said:
... In my opinion the last major industry hold out is the 'construction trades'. It seems not many people give a second thought to the amount of metric in food, electronics, and automotive items.
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If we do a "hard" conversion, then 2 x 4 ceilings and lots of other things go away as the physical size has to change. (the conversions used in the NEC are "soft" conversions)
It would make things difficult for a time.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I often trash those screws and tap the bar for 8x32 screws but the problem is when the screws get install so the threads are showing and a small cap is used. Those caps are not 8x32.
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Will the caps tap to an 8/32 or are they bigger than the 8/32 to start with? I suppose you could tap a regular or swivel fixture bar for the thru-metric and use 8/32 on the mount holes. Now if you could find a metric fixture bar...
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
If we do a "hard" conversion, then 2 x 4 ceilings and lots of other things go away as the physical size has to change. (the conversions used in the NEC are "soft" conversions)
It would make things difficult for a time.
Click to expand...

So???
Soft conversions, and 'made up' dimensions, are already part of everyday trade slang, such as 2x4 stud and 1/2" EMT.
 
...the small caps are the thing that really chaps my ass the most; especially on vanity lights, where you have to put the screw caps on BEHIND a BAR!!. so even if you throw out the caps, then it is such a joy after tapping the bracket, to try and get a driver bit on a screw head you can't even reach because it has some stupid bar right in front of it.

...i can and do get rid of the screws. i do have a tap, but what about joeblo homeowner who just installs the light fixture w/o a second thought? the UL didn't seem to care for the argument either.

...re: going metric. if it aint broke, don't fix it.

and on the lighter side i was at HoDepo today and there was joeblo homeowner asking the clerk to find him those metric screws, hahahaha. they had them. but, back to the little screw caps, you can't cut the screews for them with anything because our screwcutters don't fit. and it's much more than that, the fixtures don't even get sent with other parts that they need or are just not going to go together. there is NO QC. NONE. Even Intermatics new weatherproof bubble cover for a single GFI recep in a round 3/0 or 2g box is a complete ABORTION. so much of what we use that we used to take for granted, is now absolute un tested, GARBAGE that is designed by a complete, utter idiot. Its impossible to charge set pricing for installing a light fixture. it absolutely must be by the hour. But i digress. SOMEBODY has to START holding manufacturers accountable for their crap. And that goes for the razor sharp edges of fluorescent fixture parts and box edges too. Yes, there is a quantum leap of stress that is now an everyday part of this trade that i surely wish i could do without. Caused solely by corporate greed, aka capitalism w/o competition.
 
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