Re: bathroom switch location, I had a similar situation as racerdave3, got gigged, AHJ said violation of 680. Circuit was GFCI protected.... still no deal. Really chaps me to get tagged on something that is permitted by the code. Guess you have no recourse..... Anyone else have this problem or is my inspector just misinformed?
Location of bathroom switches
- Thread starter PEI
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Welcome to the forum.
What section of 680 did the inspector cite?
Outside of Part VII of 680 that deals with hydromassage bathtubs, 680 does not apply to a bathtub.
Chris
What section of 680 did the inspector cite?
Outside of Part VII of 680 that deals with hydromassage bathtubs, 680 does not apply to a bathtub.
Chris
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
I don't know what issue you are talking about (i.e., from some other thread). What was your installation, and what was the issue about the switch location? Also, what switch are you talking about (i.e., overhead lights, fan, light over bathtub/shower area, bathtub jets)?
Had 3 single pole switches , for recessed light over tub, exhaust fan, vanity light. Located as far as phsyically possible from tub (about 4 ft) GFCI protected, AHJ just said It's in 680..... no particular section mentioned. never been tagged on this before, just wondering if it is a common thing with inspectors to be misinformed.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
I believe that the inspector is referencing 680.22(D) which requires switching devices to be located at least 5 feet horizontally from the inside walls of a pool. This section does not apply to a bathtub.
Unfortunately there are some misinformed inspectors, just as there are misinformed electricians, contractors, engineers etc....
Chris
PEI,
In response to your statement: “just wondering if it is a common thing with inspectors to be misinformed.”
…My personal experience as an electrical contractor (now retired) and having been in business for 23+ years, is that as a group:
Electrical Engineers
Electrical Designers
Electrical Contractors
Electrical installers (craftsmen)
Electrical Inspectors
…I have found that electrical inspectors (as a group) are the most informed and the most knowledgeable on the NEC … (…others, admittedly, may have experiences which differ….)
In this case, as Chris noted, he is incorrect and Article 680 does not apply to switch and receptacle placement adjacent to hydromassage bathtubs (Article 680 directs the reader to Chapter 4 for these installations) ...
mweaver
In response to your statement: “just wondering if it is a common thing with inspectors to be misinformed.”
…My personal experience as an electrical contractor (now retired) and having been in business for 23+ years, is that as a group:
Electrical Engineers
Electrical Designers
Electrical Contractors
Electrical installers (craftsmen)
Electrical Inspectors
…I have found that electrical inspectors (as a group) are the most informed and the most knowledgeable on the NEC
… (…others, admittedly, may have experiences which differ….)In this case, as Chris noted, he is incorrect and Article 680 does not apply to switch and receptacle placement adjacent to hydromassage bathtubs (Article 680 directs the reader to Chapter 4 for these installations) ...
mweaver
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Sorry if I came across as generalizing inspectors as misinformed, I agree that as a group the inspectors I deal with are very well informed on the code. I just take it personally when I am being paid for what I know as much as for what I do and get tagged on something that in all my years in the trade(36) I've never had a problem with. Thanks for your comments, appreciate it.
- Location
- Logan, Utah
Your very welcome.
I agree that it can be very frustrating when something like this happens.
If I were you I would very politely talk with the inspector and ask where this requirement was in the code. Hopefully this person will be willing to talk about it and be open to changing their mind.
Chris
I agree that it can be very frustrating when something like this happens.
If I were you I would very politely talk with the inspector and ask where this requirement was in the code. Hopefully this person will be willing to talk about it and be open to changing their mind.
Chris
PEI,
No apologies necessary. …your taking it personally is also understood (although most inspectors would not mean it personally, I believe) …
I just (personally) like to keep in mind that the enforcement branch of the construction industry (…yes, I consider them a part of the construction team which includes inspectors, engineers, designers contractors and craftsmen…) have the enormous responsibility of ensuring that the minimum acceptable standards for electrical safety (the NEC) are maintained (for the safety of the public at large). Just like the rest of us… they also make mistakes, and just like the rest of us, they (generally) appreciate the opportunity to be corrected when they are mis-informed… (Personally, I believe EVERYONE really wants to get this electrical stuff right ...)
Chris has noted an excellent suggestion for you at the close of his post... Your approaching the inspector professionally and respectfully (with Code section in hand...) will probably provide positive results.
mweaver
No apologies necessary. …your taking it personally is also understood (although most inspectors would not mean it personally, I believe) …
I just (personally) like to keep in mind that the enforcement branch of the construction industry (…yes, I consider them a part of the construction team which includes inspectors, engineers, designers contractors and craftsmen…) have the enormous responsibility of ensuring that the minimum acceptable standards for electrical safety (the NEC) are maintained (for the safety of the public at large). Just like the rest of us… they also make mistakes, and just like the rest of us, they (generally) appreciate the opportunity to be corrected when they are mis-informed… (Personally, I believe EVERYONE really wants to get this electrical stuff right
...)Chris has noted an excellent suggestion for you at the close of his post... Your approaching the inspector professionally and respectfully (with Code section in hand...) will probably provide positive results.
mweaver
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- Location
- Logan, Utah
Your welcome.
Good luck will the face to face, hopefully it will work out.
Chris
Good luck will the face to face, hopefully it will work out.
Chris
JohnJ0906
Senior Member
- Location
- Baltimore, MD
I agree.
680 Part VII applies to hydromassage tubs, 680.72 in particular references Chapters 1 through 4 for switch locations.
JohnJ0906
Senior Member
- Location
- Baltimore, MD
One other point - 680.70 "Hydromassage tubs as defined in 680.2 shall comply with Part VII of this article. They shall not be required to comply with other parts of this article."
Pierre C Belarge
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Show the inspector Section:
404.4 Damp or Wet locations.
Switches shall not be installed within wet locations in tub or shower spaces unless installed as part of a listed tub or shower assembly.
Otherwise, there is no restriction as to the proximity of the switch to a tub or hydromassage tub.
404.4 Damp or Wet locations.
Switches shall not be installed within wet locations in tub or shower spaces unless installed as part of a listed tub or shower assembly.
Otherwise, there is no restriction as to the proximity of the switch to a tub or hydromassage tub.
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician (retired)
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician (retired)
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
And I will add that if the tub has no shower then it can be on the wall above the tub. Go ahead I can take it..
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician (retired)
And I will add that if the tub has no shower then it can be on the wall above the tub. Go ahead I can take it..
I agree. I should have said a tub with a shower.
electricmanscott
Senior Member
- Location
- Boston, MA
- Occupation
- Massachusetts Master Electrician, one man show.
- Status