Looking for a nondimming 4way "knuckle" switch

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dnem

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I know what the first question will be:
What's a knuckle switch and how is it different from a button switch ?

A knuckle switch can be depressed from any angle, top, bottom, either side, or straight in and its position changes. . A button switch requires pressure straight in from the front and some don't change with each press but rather come in pairs, one button for "on" and one button for "off"

Like this:
http://www.classicaccents.net/cgi-b...+Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=CAI&Category_Code=PBS

I'm looking for a knuckle switch like this:
http://www.lutron.com/qoto/?s=17000&t=17200#switches

This particular one shown has a slide dimmer on the right side of the knuckle. . I might want one or 2 of those but most of what I want to buy would be nondimming switches. . This Qoto model shown has the nondimming variety but it doesn't come in 4ways. . I definitely will need some 4ways. . Lutron has an upgraded line at 10 times the price called Faedra that doesn't use 3ways and 4ways but rather one master switch and any number of slave switches but the master doesn't come in a nondimming variety.

Does anybody know where I can find nondimming single pole, 3way, and 4way knuckle switches ?

David
 
I don't think you will find a switch with all those features that doesn't dim. Other than cost what is the problem with using a dimmer? Are you controlling something that can't be dimmed.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I don't think you will find a switch with all those features that doesn't dim. Other than cost what is the problem with using a dimmer? Are you controlling something that can't be dimmed.
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I want to use it in hallways and don't want my kids screwing around with setting. . I don't see a need to dim the hallway lights and think adding the dimmer only adds me having to repeatedly ask thruout the years, "Who's screwing around with the hallway light switch ?"

Believe it or not, I actually considered sticking a master [which only comes as a dimmer] in my bedroom closet where no one will know about it or bother it and nondimming slaves at the various desired spots in the hallway but that's a pretty stupid solution.

I can find 100s of options in nondimming toggle 4ways and 100s of options in nondimming rocker 4ways, why can't I find one nondimming knuckle 4way ?

David
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Call Lutron-- maybe they have one and don't show it on the site-- tollfree
1.800.523.9466
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I did and they don't offer knuckle 4ways. . It's their way of forcing you into their more expensive Faedra model. . Their concept is that all applications of 3 or more point control can use their master/slave design of Faedra. . Of course Fardra only comes as a dimmer.

Just 2 problems with that concept:

1] If you can't offer a base system for the spec home, then you don't have a starting point to upgrade from. . You can't get interest started when you don't have the necessary product line to build on. . You never get to the point of selling the Faedra when the supporting Qoto line is not able to provide a base line of non dimming products.

2] You can't sell a builder on a product that forces dimmers into applications where they're not wanted. . I imagine that most people are like me and are not interested in having a dimmer on hallway lighting and yet the lack of a 4way forces dimmers [with the expensive model being the only option] to be installed in these locations.

I many times wonder how some people get the jobs that they get. . Somebody in Lutron made a decision on how to proceed with this Qoto/Faedra line. . And if it fails it will be blamed on lack of interest in knuckle switches.

Reality is that they screwed up the product line.

David
 
I am curious as to why you want a knuckle switch. Why not use a standard switch if you don't want a dimmer?

I agree--- Lutron should offer the full line of switches so that everything matches in the house. I take it you have an interest in the design.

I have never bought either of those models and I don't know why I would. They would definitely have to offer the full line to interest customers of mine. Maybe they will one day.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I am curious as to why you want a knuckle switch. Why not use a standard switch if you don't want a dimmer?
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I really like the knuckle switch alot. . I'm putting a small addition on my house and finishing the basement. . I'd like to change over the whole house to knuckle switches.

Dennis Alwon said:
I agree--- Lutron should offer the full line of switches so that everything matches in the house. I take it you have an interest in the design.

I have never bought either of those models and I don't know why I would. They would definitely have to offer the full line to interest customers of mine. Maybe they will one day.
Click to expand...

"They would definitely have to offer the full line to interest customers of mine."
Doesn't that seem totally obvious to everybody ? . What's wrong with the Lutron people that they don't "get it" ? . Why are people in charge of product development that don't understand the basics of marketing ?

David
 
romexking said:
Could you preset the dimming to full brightness and not tell anyone how to reset it? Some switches require a certain number of taps to set and reset the presets.
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I like the knuckle switch so much that I'm considering that option.

But I'm also really mad at Lutron for being so incompetant at product development that they've put a person like myself, that's so sold on their product, in a position of giving up and buying a regular toggle switch from someone else.

If you have a unique product, you've effectively cornered the market for people interested in that product. . Price doesn't become the primary motivator for those customers.

Why would you want to chase those customers away ?

David
 
I agree that it is quite lame that they offer a particular mechanical switch, in most but not all standard configurations.

Given the limitations of manufacturing, I guess it becomes prohibitive to offer _all_ the possible combinations that people want in _all_ of the flavors. It might pay if they offered their 'remote control' based system with a master that could not be dimmed.

As an option: a single pole switch combined with an appropriate relay will serve for 4-way purposes.

I don't know if suitable relays exist for installation as part of normal house wiring without going to large control panels with DIN mount devices.

-Jon
 
Two taps on the Maestro line of microprocessor type of multi-location switches instantly ramps the dimmable lights up to full speed. Why is this such a chore?

edit: I love the classic accents site BTW!
 
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How about you cut off the top of the little slider with a diagonal cutters then your kids will not be able to adjust without taking extra time to move a little stub. Completely my opinion but it might help.
 
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