Looking for Ideas

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I am doing a new healthcare facility, the critical circuit, and life safety circuit panelboards have numerous spares, so to ease future connection without having to shut these panels off to utilize the spares, I wanted to take the homeruns out to a wireway, so for future connections an individual LOTO device for that individual circuit breaker would be all that is required to connect to the circuit.

However we will well exceed the 30 CCC allowed, if using a wireway and we dont have room for multiple screw cover jboxes.

Looking for ideas how to accomplish the same job but without violating the conductor fill in a wireway.

If anyone has seen a good install for this situation I would love to see it.
 

nakulak

Senior Member
make it 24" or less ? (a nipple) (of course, not sure I'm undestanding what you are asking for as the detaiils are sketchy)
 
I was trying to be brief but I guess I wasnt clear...The panels are in the electrical room, I want to run homerun conduits out to the adjcent hallwayay and come into the back of the wireway with all 42 circuits. Then come out of the top of the wireway with the circuits needed per plans and leave room for other to only have to tie into the wireway in the future. thus never having to shut the panel down to get into it to add circuits. The spares will already be out in the hallway for any changes or adds in the future.

My understanding of a "cross section" would be looking at the face of the opening and just from top to bottom. so if I am coming into the back and the crossing to make joints on future conduits added later it would then violate the code, so I am looking for alternatives ?

I hope that is a little more clear.
 

cadpoint

Senior Member
Location
Durham, NC
I was trying to be brief but I guess I wasnt clear... I hope that is a little more clear.

Welcome to the Club !

Because of the nature of it being both a health care facility and as U said "I am doing a new healthcare facility, the critical circuit, and life safety circuit panelboards"

I would think a good through read of the approicate articles would be desireable here, there's no mixing and match of these circuits, its a total isolation thing due to health care facility.

Sorry, but it was not clear even now that these circuits of how or what remains for their future desired service application? IF your saying that the future circuit will be out to some point and wire nutted off ?... I don't know.

The Crowd and the Guests here all know that "hot work" is not required, day in and day out. be safe, turn it off!
 
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Cow

Senior Member
Location
Eastern Oregon
Occupation
Electrician
Is it possible to use 2 smaller wireways chase nippled together rather than one large wireway? I've heard one of our guys has used that trick before...
 
yes understand health care and the seperation thats not the intention, a wireway for the 42 circuits out of critical power, and a seperate wireway for the 42 ckts out of life safety panelboard... no mixing intended.

ok let me put it another way, out of a 42 ckt panel 20 circuits are used per plans, instead of leaving the other 22 spare breakers empty, my intention is to take them out to this wireway. I dont know what their future is, they are just spares for now but they are still c.c.c. and at this point they are not crossing inside a the wireway but to add on to them later then they will. All I am trying to do is save having to schedule a shutdown of a critical power panel to add a circuit later.
 
I am thinking 2 wireways is my only option...someone had suggested in another thread of similar type question about using dividers...I have not seen a divider for a wireway, does such a thing exsist ?

I have seen end caps installed inside of a wireway, but to me thats not a divider as it is not listed for that purpose ?
 
I found some pictures of previous project with a somewhat similar situation that may make this a bit clearer.

Homerun conduits leaving the electric room

DSC00654.jpg


Turning and going through a sheetrock ceiling area to get into accessible ceiling space ( taking me well out of the 24" nipple use....

DSC00655.jpg


And then coming into the wireway, and leaving again, but with little to no cross over of the conductors.

DSC00657.jpg


However with the current project, I can not limit the crossover within the wireway as done in this project, so looking for additional options....
 
That seems to be the only alternative, I was told today that it is really a mute point that 2008 NEC changed article 376 to do away with the words "cross section" that it now says no more than 30 C.C.C. in a wireway...period...

I don't have my 2008 book yet, but that change is not shown on Mike Holt's list of changes can someone confirm this ?
 

billdozier

Senior Member
Location
gulf coast
I might be misunderstanding this but what im hearing is you want to pull conducters that are not feeding anything into a wireway? How would you let future ecs know where these wires go? I believe in looking out for the next guy but this sounds like overkill. Am I missing something?
 
Well the main future ecs I am looking out for is myself....this is a 3 year project so I have little doubt that things wont change before we are finished. Second its a health care facility with a full time maintenance staff, I am sure they would appreciate it and also inform any other ecs, before they wanted to go shutting down their critical care panels.

Maybe it is overkill, I don't know - just trying to provide a little better product than the next guy.
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Overall I think that you have a good idea running the circuits for the future. As it stands you're use of a wireway will cause issues with the 30 CCC rule. The simplest solution is find an alternative to the wireway.
 

benaround

Senior Member
Location
Arizona
That seems to be the only alternative, I was told today that it is really a mute point that 2008 NEC changed article 376 to do away with the words "cross section" that it now says no more than 30 C.C.C. in a wireway...period...

I don't have my 2008 book yet, but that change is not shown on Mike Holt's list of changes can someone confirm this ?

That is not true, the format in the 2008 has changed but it still says the same thing.
 
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