ME takes cues from a Plumber??!

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Legio501st

Member
Several months ago I was working for a contractor who holds a master electrician's lic. that took direction from a plumber. In one instance the plumber told him to run #8 wire for 100A subpanels because there was a #8 on the prints that pointed to the run. I protested and let it be known what size wire (#3) that it should have been, but my pleas went unheard. Long story short, the guy had us run the #8 to all the subpanels, then the plumber came back at the end of the day and told us that he made a mistake and that the #8 on the print was referring to the job notes (duh) and that we would have to re-pull everything. A few minutes of looking at the print and checking the supply trailer would have saved a lot of $$ and aggravation.

The bad thing is that the ME followed the plumber's direction in the first place.

That's just one story I have for the short time I worked for that outfit.

Thoughts, opinions, denials?
 
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satcom

Senior Member
brantmacga said:
the term "Master Electrician" is just a word on a piece of paper.
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It is more then a piece of paper, it usually denotes many years of work experience, usually a min of 10 years but even at 10 they are just beginning to learn, and they have passed an exam to show the can master the knowladge required to preform at a masters level. the guy you are addressing must of had a brain injury has mental problems, or is using someones license. We had one running loose that claimed he was a Master electrician, he helped rough a few houses, and changed lamps at a local plant.
 
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mike johnson

Member
Misunderstanding

Misunderstanding

I believe he told you he was a master and really was not. Did you see his id card? Does he have a license #? There are many people with dreams in the electrical field who cannot get to a licensed level but believe they are regardless of law and testing.
 
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Legio501st

Member
Yeah, actually he does have a ME lic. as well as a contractors lic.

You want me to tell you what happened when he tried to pull solid #12 through a run containing five 90* bends?

There was a box where he could have looped out and re-fed the wire, which I suggested, but he wanted to see if he could do it. He wound up haveing to re mount the pipe and re-run the wire becaue he pulled the pipe right out of the Caddy clips.

Evidently he started out life as a plumber, and had enough wiring experience with residential stuff to grandfather in to the system here. Definately not a commercial/lilght industry electrician.

My problem is that he showed no backbone or stood up to someone that had no right to dictate means or method in our craft.
 
George Stolz

George Stolz

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Location
Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
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Service Manager
Legio501st said:
My problem is that he showed no backbone or stood up to someone that had no right to dictate means or method in our craft.
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I hate to sound callous, but do you recognize the irony of that statement, considering that you've signed up to a website anonymously to broadcast his shortcomings?

I'm not perfect, and I know this. I appreciate when people come to me and address them to me, as opposed to the alternatives.
 
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Legio501st

Member
That's just the thng, I addressed the issues with the guy at the time. And while I won't say his name or company publicly, you can feel free to PM me and I will tell you that information. We do have to be careful in what we say on a public forum, but I feel that I should let those who are serious about our profession know the kind of bubbas out there who are trying to make a quick buck and that you will still see some goofy things out there by "electricians".

The real dig is that he has left messages on my voice mail calling me incompetent.

Of course I did turn him in to the IRS for misclassifying his employees and to the DOL for not paying OT. Don't know why he would be mad:rolleyes: .

I only worked for him for about six weeks, but I was already making plans to quit. I haven't worked for him since November of last year, yet he calls to harass me.

I didn't sign up here to broadcast shortcomings, I've lurked here for a while and have finally decided to sign up.

georgestolz said:
I hate to sound callous, but do you recognize the irony of that statement, considering that you've signed up to a website anonymously to broadcast his shortcomings?

I'm not perfect, and I know this. I appreciate when people come to me and address them to me, as opposed to the alternatives.
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mike johnson

Member
Master Electrician

Master Electrician

Originally Posted by brantmacga
the term "Master Electrician" is just a word on a piece of paper.

iwire said:
I agree.

Being able to pass a test has nothing to do with the quality of someones work.
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Being a Master Electrician is a huge accomplishment and shows every one at an apprentice, helper, or journey level that you have earned the skills and knowledge to have what it takes to become one. You cannot obtain a Master Electricians license without a hsd or ged that's for sure. To degrade a Master Electricians license is just like degrading a Doctor with a PhD because it means a person has achieved to the highest level of their profession. Maybe you have seen a Master Electrician who did not perform certain parts of the trade the way you feel they should have but the title they have shows that they have proved to the state which they are in that they have the ability to figure tough electrical situations out nomatter how much time it takes to protect and keep the public safe from electrical danger.
 
iwire

iwire

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Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
mike johnson said:
Being a Master Electrician is a huge accomplishment and shows every one at an apprentice, helper, or journey level that you have earned the skills and knowledge to have what it takes to become one.
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Mike here in MA all it takes is the ability to hold a job for a certain period of time and the ability to pass an open book test.

Neither of those prove that a person will be a good electrician.

I work with Masters that scare me and apprentices that impress the heck out of me.

Sorry, to me all it means is that you are legally qualified to perform electric work, it does not mean your proficient at it. The same can be said for doctors as well.
 
iaov

iaov

Senior Member
Location
Rhinelander WI
As a lot of you guys know I recently passed the Wi. Masters test. My wife thought it would be interesting to see just who in my area realy had a Masters certification. When she looked up the info at the State sight we found out that 3 guys that I know of who claim to be Master Electricians are not!! To me having a Masters certification means I've learned enough to know just how much I don't know! I do believe though that even a first year apprentice should know not to take wiring advice from a plumber!!:D
 
brian john

brian john

Senior Member
Location
Leesburg, VA
Being a master holds a certain "yes he did it"

BUT.

I have had a masters since I was 21, knowing what I know now I realized at 21 I probably was not ready for the privilege of holding this card. I kept this fact to myself only telling my boss (hoping for a raise). I felt the older mechanics that were good electricians might get an attitude with me as NONE of then even had a journeyman's license.

I meet with electricians that tell me "I AM A MASTER", and often state this often during our conversation. These guys always worry me and expierence has proven it mot of them are not decent electricians (field work wise).

I also go to projects with wiring issues and hear the often repeated statements. "Well it passed inspection" and a "Master wired this" or a "Master has tried to figure out the problem". These mean little or nothing to me. One because inspectors in most/all cases cannot catch everything, and a masters can be had by studying and working for a contractor, it does not always mean anything more than this.

When I obtained by DC masters I made friends with this guy that was obtaining his masters, he took the same study course I did, and worked for a large EC/HVAC/plumber in the plumbing division purchasing department. They gave him the letter for time that was required. Took him 4 tries to get the license, but he finally passed.
 
growler

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
Legio501st said:
Evidently he started out life as a plumber, and had enough wiring experience with residential stuff to grandfather in to the system here. Definately not a commercial/lilght industry electrician.
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I know of at least one plumber that has an unrestricted electrical contractors license that he grandfathered into back in the early 80's. It was common enough for plumbers to hold a plumbing and electrical license when all they had to do was pay $20 for a local license. The only thing they used the license for was running power to the water heater, most didn't have any real electrical experience even in residential.

This is one of the many flaws of "grandfathering". I worked for a contractor at one time that had obtained a license and had actually never done any electrical work, he inherited the family business. The good thing was that he was smart enough to know that he was not an electrician and never did any work in the field. He was a good businessman and things worked out for him until he died if cancer.
 
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