Means of disconnect

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Moby

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I have been challenged on a code for means of disconnect for a a/c condenser. Does the 3’ by 30” apply to this disconnect
The person said since there is no neutral wire in it this rule does not apply. Please let me know because I have done this and enforced this for many years. Thank you
 
Is it a fused disconnect switch or a non-fused switch. There have been many comments about this before. If it is fused then the equipment would fall into 110.26 because the fuses could require maintenance, but a non-fused switch would not meet the requirements necessary to comply with 110.26.
 
Rock86 said:
Is it a fused disconnect switch or a non-fused switch. There have been many comments about this before. If it is fused then the equipment would fall into 110.26 because the fuses could require maintenance, but a non-fused switch would not meet the requirements necessary to comply with 110.26.
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It sure does if I and many others are inspecting. Examination includes voltage verification, and when someone trouble shoots the AC unit, in many cases, the disconnect is the very first place the troubleshooter checks for voltage before opening the covers on the equipment.
CMP 11 completely cleared this issue up in the 2023 code. (new text in bold below)
440.14 Location.
Disconnecting means shall be located within sight from, and readily accessible from, the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment. The disconnecting means shall be permitted to be installed on or within the air-conditioning or refrigerating equipment. Disconnecting means shall meet the working space requirements of 110.26(A).

The disconnecting means shall not be located on panels that are designed to allow access to the air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment or where it obscures the equipment nameplate(s).
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don_resqcapt19 said:
It sure does if I and many others are inspecting. Examination includes voltage verification, and when someone trouble shoots the AC unit, in many cases, the disconnect is the very first place the troubleshooter checks for voltage before opening the covers on the equipment.
CMP 11 completely cleared this issue up in the 2023 code. (new text in bold below)
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I stand corrected, thank you. From interpretations I have always been told was what I had described. Maybe that is way the 2023 code is making it clear.

" Examination includes voltage verification, and when someone trouble shoots " This I would argue is not a valid reason, although I do agree with how you are interpreting the situation. 110.26 states "... read and safe operation and maintenance of such equipment." A receptacle could require troubleshooting, but that does not require working space clearance. A better argument would be the "safe operation" where the technician would be required to switch the disconnect on or off.

All and all, I will agree and accept that my view of the code should change.
 
Rock86 said:
I stand corrected, thank you. From interpretations I have always been told was what I had described. Maybe that is way the 2023 code is making it clear.

" Examination includes voltage verification, and when someone trouble shoots " This I would argue is not a valid reason, although I do agree with how you are interpreting the situation. 110.26 states "... read and safe operation and maintenance of such equipment." A receptacle could require troubleshooting, but that does not require working space clearance. A better argument would be the "safe operation" where the technician would be required to switch the disconnect on or off.

All and all, I will agree and accept that my view of the code should change.
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The code language in 110.26(A) needs work as the current language requires working space for that receptacle. No one enforces it that way, but the words say.
110.26 Spaces About Electrical Equipment.
Working space, and access to and egress from working space, shall be provided and maintained about all electrical equipment to permit ready and safe operation and maintenance of such equipment. Open equipment doors shall not impede access to and egress from the working space. Access or egress is impeded if one or more simultaneously opened equipment doors restrict working space access to be less than 610 mm (24 in.) wide and 2.0 m (61⁄2 ft) high.
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don_resqcapt19 said:
Apparently the writer of the answer to question #1 has never tried to troubleshoot malfunctioning equipment, because almost 100% of the that is done while the equipment is energized.
Wonder if North Carolina will amend 440.14 when the adopt the 2023 code?
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I would disagree. A non-fused disconnect is not required to be energized for troubleshooting. The equipment it is serving, would require it to be energized, but voltage can be checked at the equipment and the source without checking the switch. A disconnect switch could be de-energized at the source, checked for continuity, and then re-energized if no fault is found. I'm not saying that is the most practical way to do it, but it would be a safer way, and there it is less likely to be a problem with a non-fused switch than a fused.
 
If I had an AC where the nameplate stated 30A for Max. fuse or HACR breaker, if I installed a 30A breaker in the panel and used a 30A double pole switch by the AC unit as the disconnecting means, would I still need clearances described in 110.26? I did this a lot years ago when I was doing houses. The AC guys supplied their own pads and always placed them to where the non-fusible disconnects did not have the proper clearance. I was tired of the failed inspections on the final so by using a 2 pole switch, the clearance was not necessary.
 
Rock86 said:
I would disagree. A non-fused disconnect is not required to be energized for troubleshooting. The equipment it is serving, would require it to be energized, but voltage can be checked at the equipment and the source without checking the switch. A disconnect switch could be de-energized at the source, checked for continuity, and then re-energized if no fault is found. I'm not saying that is the most practical way to do it, but it would be a safer way, and there it is less likely to be a problem with a non-fused switch than a fused.
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Nothing is required to be energized for troubleshooting so if you go that route we never need the 110.26(A) working spaces.

However it is very likely that the disconnect at the equipment, fused or non-fused, will be examined for troubleshooting. If I am a service tech, why would I want to take out all of the screws on the AC access plates to check for voltage, only to find out that the problem is external to my equipment.

You will get a red tag from me every time from me if you do not have the 110.26(A) working spaces for the AC disconnect.

Now the 23 code has made that clear to everyone.
 
Rick 0920 said:
If I had an AC where the nameplate stated 30A for Max. fuse or HACR breaker, if I installed a 30A breaker in the panel and used a 30A double pole switch by the AC unit as the disconnecting means, would I still need clearances described in 110.26? I did this a lot years ago when I was doing houses. The AC guys supplied their own pads and always placed them to where the non-fusible disconnects did not have the proper clearance. I was tired of the failed inspections on the final so by using a 2 pole switch, the clearance was not necessary.
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By Don's stance you would still fail.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
Nothing is required to be energized for troubleshooting so if you go that route we never need the 110.26(A) working spaces.
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Again I would disagree. An electrical panel would required to be energized because it would be your source for voltage. It would have to be tested while energized. An AC unit would require to be energized because it would have to be checked for the proper voltage at the unit. A majority of the devices in between the source and the equipment I would argue could be troubleshoot without being energized.

A fused disconnect would require maintenance which would require working space, but it does not need to be energized to perform that work. What maintenance is required on a non-fused disconnect?

Like I said in the beginning, I will agree with you that it would apply for safe operation of turning off and on the switch. But think about all of those non-fused switches above tiled ceilings, in attics and crawl spaces, and tell me all of those need to have 30" x 3' plus head room.
 
Rock86 said:
Again I would disagree. An electrical panel would required to be energized because it would be your source for voltage. It would have to be tested while energized. An AC unit would require to be energized because it would have to be checked for the proper voltage at the unit. A majority of the devices in between the source and the equipment I would argue could be troubleshoot without being energized.

A fused disconnect would require maintenance which would require working space, but it does not need to be energized to perform that work. What maintenance is required on a non-fused disconnect?

Like I said in the beginning, I will agree with you that it would apply for safe operation of turning off and on the switch. But think about all of those non-fused switches above tiled ceilings, in attics and crawl spaces, and tell me all of those need to have 30" x 3' plus head room.
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Other than verifying source voltage, all other trouble shooting can be done without the presence of power. It may be difficult and take a lot of extra time, but it can be done.

I did not say you would perform maintenance on the disconnect, I only said that it would be examined while energized. The act of checking voltage is examination and requires the 110.26(A) workspace.

As far as those limited access areas, take a look at 110.26(A)(4).
 
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