Melted plastic on buss

Status
Not open for further replies.
Shaneyj

Shaneyj

Senior Member
Location
Katy, Texas
Occupation
Project Engineer
A guy at work sent me this pic. He said he had an electrician out a while back to fix. Apparently he just moved the breaker to another space. What would cause this? Seems like if it was heat from overcurrent the breaker would have tripped.
f317bc80732c57fc6a3726e50f982710.jpg


Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
 
The breaker wouldn't trip because the problem was ahead of the breaker. The heat would move more easily into the bus bar than into the breaker through that bad connection.

A bus connection bad enough to have melted insulation will have over heated the spring clips keeping the breaker connection stabs tight. It will likely fail again now on the new spot, maybe sooner.
 
Looks like there is not just heat damage on the buss stabs but corrosion as well; high resistance connection causing heat and melting? or is that charred plastic left from the last breaker?

Also, is that pic of a CH BR breaker?
 
JFletcher said:
Looks like there is not just heat damage on the buss stabs but corrosion as well; high resistance connection causing heat and melting? or is that charred plastic left from the last breaker?

Also, is that pic of a CH BR breaker?
Click to expand...
It looks like corrosion, but I figured the black on the actual buss was char residue from the goop (di electric grease?) that comes on the breakers.
And yes, that is a br breaker- 2 pole 40. Along with a Siemens 20 and a GE 20 in a panel I assume is t and b, because that's what the main is.
I'll see the guy at work today and he is going to explain the unknowns.

Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
 
Shaneyj said:
It looks like corrosion, but I figured the black on the actual buss was char residue from the goop (di electric grease?) that comes on the breakers.
And yes, that is a br breaker- 2 pole 40. Along with a Siemens 20 and a GE 20 in a panel I assume is t and b, because that's what the main is.
I'll see the guy at work today and he is going to explain the unknowns.

Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Is the 2 pole 40 what was originally plugged onto the damaged bus area? If so was it supplying maybe air conditioning or other load that often runs for long period of time? High load and long run times gets the majority of those kinds of failure, because it heats up the connection and keeps it hot. Otherwise most of your dwelling loads aren't that heavy of a load or don't run that long to cause this kind of failure as easily as a heating or air conditioning load.
 
kwired said:
Is the 2 pole 40 what was originally plugged onto the damaged bus area? If so was it supplying maybe air conditioning or other load that often runs for long period of time? High load and long run times gets the majority of those kinds of failure, because it heats up the connection and keeps it hot. Otherwise most of your dwelling loads aren't that heavy of a load or don't run that long to cause this kind of failure as easily as a heating or air conditioning load.
Click to expand...
I just talked with the guy. It was the 40 supplying an ac unit. I'm going to research approved devices for that panel and get him sorted out.
Is it safe to assume T&B buss given T&B main?
Another pic...
cded605cda39ddf51744a24a014241b9.jpg


Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
 
Shaneyj said:
I just talked with the guy. It was the 40 supplying an ac unit. I'm going to research approved devices for that panel and get him sorted out.
Is it safe to assume T&B buss given T&B main?
Another pic...
cded605cda39ddf51744a24a014241b9.jpg


Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Looks a lot like old Murray or Crouse Hinds designs. I think Murray line still exists, but is owned by Siemens.

My opinion, run it as is until it fails again, then replace the panel, or better yet replace the panel at most convenient time, but before it fails again. Look at the condition of the supply side lugs - it is probably already waiting to fail, but could be next week, six months or six years before it does.
 
Shaneyj said:
He said he had an electrician out a while back to fix. Apparently he just moved the breaker to another space.
Click to expand...

ptonsparky said:
He should have replaced the breaker and moved it to a different lug. Damage was already done.
Click to expand...

I doubt that he moved that breaker to another space. I would assume he did replace it.

Most of the time when a buss is burned that bad there is not much left of the breaker in the heated area. He would need to be blind not to see the damage.
 
FWIW that is a Zinsco style main.

Homeowners insurance companies in Florida are often not writing policies on homes that have them (Challenger, T+B, Zinsco)
 
growler said:
I doubt that he moved that breaker to another space. I would assume he did replace it.

Most of the time when a buss is burned that bad there is not much left of the breaker in the heated area. He would need to be blind not to see the damage.
Click to expand...
I'd agree, that 2 pole looks newer than the rest.

Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
 
Shaneyj said:
A guy at work sent me this pic. He said he had an electrician out a while back to fix. Apparently he just moved the breaker to another space. What would cause this? Seems like if it was heat from overcurrent the breaker would have tripped.
f317bc80732c57fc6a3726e50f982710.jpg


Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
One guess is moister issues inside the panel.The breaker looks newer than the rest. I would recommend replacing the panel the next time it convenient to do so.
 
Shaneyj said:
I just talked with the guy. It was the 40 supplying an ac unit. I'm going to research approved devices for that panel and get him sorted out.
Is it safe to assume T&B buss given T&B main?
Another pic...
cded605cda39ddf51744a24a014241b9.jpg


Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Is that a bullet impact above left of the bottom center PVC conduit? and almost out of frame left center? :blink:
 
JFletcher said:
Is that a bullet impact above left of the bottom center PVC conduit? and almost out of frame left center? :blink:
Click to expand...
Being that this is a south Texas, I'm guessing mud dauber... But I haven't seen it in person. These pics are all I have.

Sent from my HTC6545LVW using Tapatalk
 
T&B was Challenger which was Sylvania (Zinsco) & shared the design with the then Westinghouse BR line, which is why I call Westinghouse/C-H/ Eaton BR "Zinsco II".


Always wondered why T&B discontinued that line that they advertised the breakers as UL classified be used all or most of their competitors panels.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top