Meter pan after service disconnect

[Ken9876]

Looked at a service the other day, the meter was located after the service disconnect. The grounded conductor was never bonded to the service disconnect enclosure, it was passed through into the meter enclosure where it was bonded to the meter enclosure and a #8 bonding jumper was brought back to the service disconnect for bonding. I'm ordering a ground lug kit for the disconnect, however how do I handle the meter enclosure? I don't know if there is a way to separate the equipment grounds and neutrals at the meter enclosure. PVC was used between meter and service enclosures.

 

[Little Bill]

Looked at a service the other day, the meter was located after the service disconnect. The grounded conductor was never bonded to the service disconnect enclosure, it was passed through into the meter enclosure where it was bonded to the meter enclosure and a #8 bonding jumper was brought back to the service disconnect for bonding. I'm ordering a ground lug kit for the disconnect, however how do I handle the meter enclosure? I don't know if there is a way to separate the equipment grounds and neutrals at the meter enclosure. PVC was used between meter and service enclosures.

That disconnect may be required by the POCO and if so, it wouldn't be treated the same as the service disconnect required under the NEC.

 

[Strathead]

That disconnect may be required by the POCO and if so, it wouldn't be treated the same as the service disconnect required under the NEC.

That is what I was thinking. Progress Energy does that in this area. The "disconnect" is part of the Utlity Company equipment and it is not fused or otherwise amperage rated. The Service Disconnect is still the first means of disconnect on the load side of the meter.

 

[kwired]

So the question to the OP is whether or not there is a "service disconnect" on the load side of the meter?

 

[Ken9876]

The disconnect before the meter is fused. The conductors then enter the meter, where the equipment grounding conductor originates. From the meter they run 500' to a remote structure to a breaker at the remote structure.

 

[jap]

The Power Company here requires a disconnect ahead of the meter on 480v Services Only.
This is not considered the "Service Disconnect".
Only a Safety Switch they can shut off so they can Safely pull or service the Meter.

 

[kwired]

250.142(B) exception 2 likely allows you to bond the meter enclosure with the grounded conductor, good thing is you said you have non metallic raceway so that prevents the raceway from becoming a parallel path for neutral current.

Exception No. 2: It shall be permissible to ground meter enclosures by connection to the grounded circuit conductor on the load side of the service disconnect where all of the following conditions apply:

(1)

No service ground-fault protection is installed.

(2)

All meter enclosures are located immediately adjacent to the service disconnecting means.

(3)

The size of the grounded circuit conductor is not smaller than the size specified in Table 250.122 for equipment grounding conductors.

I have the opinion that the 200 amp disconnect is the service disconnect since it contains overcurrent devices, and the equipment grounding conductors should originate there with the allowed exception in 250.142(B) if it is done in a way there is no objectionable current over metal raceways, enclosures, etc. Is the neutral in this 4 gang meter permanently bonded to the can or is there a jumper, screw, etc. that can be installed/removed as needed? I would isolate neutral in meters if it is easy to do so.

Keep in mind your grounded conductor as well as the equipment grounding conductor need sized to the 200 amp overcurrent device on the supply side and not the 100 amp device on the load side, or be no larger than the ungrounded conductors if they would happen to be smaller than 250.122 (which should not be a problem in this case).

 

[kwired]

250.142(B) exception 2 likely allows you to bond the meter enclosure with the grounded conductor, good thing is you said you have non metallic raceway so that prevents the raceway from becoming a parallel path for neutral current.


I have the opinion that the 200 amp disconnect is the service disconnect since it contains overcurrent devices, and the equipment grounding conductors should originate there with the allowed exception in 250.142(B) if it is done in a way there is no objectionable current over metal raceways, enclosures, etc. Is the neutral in this 4 gang meter permanently bonded to the can or is there a jumper, screw, etc. that can be installed/removed as needed? I would isolate neutral in meters if it is easy to do so.

Keep in mind your grounded conductor as well as the equipment grounding conductor need sized to the 200 amp overcurrent device on the supply side and not the 100 amp device on the load side, or be no larger than the ungrounded conductors if they would happen to be smaller than 250.122 (which should not be a problem in this case).

Some of what I said here applies, some of it - I had the content of another thread but similar topic on my mind and did not realize I was replying to a different thread.

OP in this thread did not mention size of disconnects or the fact it was a 4 gang meter socket, those parts were from a different therad. Sorry for any confusion.

 

[Ken9876]

Some of what I said here applies, some of it - I had the content of another thread but similar topic on my mind and did not realize I was replying to a different thread.

OP in this thread did not mention size of disconnects or the fact it was a 4 gang meter socket, those parts were from a different therad. Sorry for any confusion.

Thank you for the info, very helpful

 

[hillbilly1]

Cold sequence metering, usually 400 amp 480 volt services, mainly a poco requirement to make it safer for their meter guys and gals.

 

[iwire]

Looked at a service the other day, the meter was located after the service disconnect. The grounded conductor was never bonded to the service disconnect enclosure, it was passed through into the meter enclosure where it was bonded to the meter enclosure and a #8 bonding jumper was brought back to the service disconnect for bonding. I'm ordering a ground lug kit for the disconnect, however how do I handle the meter enclosure? I don't know if there is a way to separate the equipment grounds and neutrals at the meter enclosure. PVC was used between meter and service enclosures.

You need to make a proper bond in the service disconnect and leave the bond in the meter as well I know that sounds odd but it is directly allowed by the NEC.

 

[Ken9876]

You need to make a proper bond in the service disconnect and leave the bond in the meter as well I know that sounds odd but it is directly allowed by the NEC.

Thank you both kwired and Bob. I see that now, I completely missed 250.142(B); I have a ground bar kit on order to correct this issue. But another question do you think there could ever be a shock hazard if touching both enclosures at the same time?

 

[kwired]

Thank you both kwired and Bob. I see that now, I completely missed 250.142(B); I have a ground bar kit on order to correct this issue. But another question do you think there could ever be a shock hazard if touching both enclosures at the same time?

If distance between enclosures is short you will not have enough voltage drop in the conductor between them to have enough voltage to even feel. Only if there is resistance in a connection or totally open neutral situation will you have that kind of trouble. In order to be a shock hazard there has to be a difference of potential.