Modifying a light fixture

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907Plummer

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I work in a Hospital that is a federal Facility, and am having some issues with the facility engineer (civil not electricial).

He is wanting us to modify some existing lights in one of the O.R. rooms to accept UV lamps.

The electricians don't want to do it, and don't want them to hire a contractor to have it done.

In the 2008 code 410.6 requires all luminaries be listed. Piece of cake right?

But

He says we are going off 2005 and is using 110.3 which dosent specifically require listing of fixtures, and I can't find anything in 05 artical 410 that prevents it. I have also looked in 517 and can't find any thing that seems to prevent it.

I know this is wrong and have got him to agree to see what the AHJ says. The problem is it is looking like he is the AHJ.

If I can back it up with the 05 code he will back off.

If anyone knows if federal facilitys are supposed to follow the newest edition of the code and I can show him he will back off.

Please help
 
907,

I'm thinking go right to the manafacture of the fixture, tell them what is

proposed to be changed, and would it violate their installation instructions

if the changes were made.

Get a yes or no answer, go from there ?
 
Yeah , CYA cuz when the light goes Kafluey and distracts the operating surgeon and he sticks his scalpel where his clamp should be , fingers will be pointing around like the scarecrow in the Wizard of OZ.
 
907Plummer said:
He is wanting us to modify some existing lights in one of the O.R. rooms to accept UV lamps.
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Tell him you are a plummer not a plumber.:grin: See if he gets your drift.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Tell him you are a plummer not a plumber.:grin: See if he gets your drift.
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That was pretty good Dennis. I was going to say he's not being to civil but yours was better. But really I would tell him you don't want to be responsible for these fixtures without getting factory approval. Its not what they were intended for.
 
It is true the 110.3(B) does not require all fixtures to be listed.
But...if the fixture has a listing, the listing becomes part of the requirement for installation. At that point, modifying the fixture may cause an issue and I as an inspector would want to see a field evaluation by a NRTL.
 
Thanks for the responses. Right after I posted the topic he got a resounding NO from the AHJ.

They sited AIA guidlines, and also asked why the heck anyone wanted UV lights in the OR anyway.

I am hoping that he learns from this, as thier response was almost word for word what we (the electricians) had been telling him all along.
 
Did he ever say WHY he wanted to use UV lights?

I might see him wanting germicidal lights. But even then you have to be careful that they are LISTED and approved for the application. Are they even allowed in an operating room?

RC
 
The head Doctor in the OR wanted them. I dont know where he came up with the idea.

We suggested handheld or portable units, but he was stuck on light fixtures for some reason.

I dont have a problem with installing UV lighting that is a clinical decision, if it goes it goes. I just want to make sure it is done right.

Which in my opinion means designing the OR around the equipment that is going to be in it and doing a remodel to get it there. Not scabbing a system together, which is what they were trying to do.
 
what about modifying a fixture to suit GSA Fire and Life Safety Inspectors with a submitted and approved by GSA electrical engineers design. I have that issue in a large federal office buiding with 157 fixtures now having problems with occupancy sensors after being installed 5 years. GSA now wants to contend the modification is the source of the problems.
 
It sounds like someone had a good idea that someone else tried to implement on the cheap.

UV lights for disinfection is becoming pretty common in ORs. It has a proven history of very substantially reducing post surgical infection rates.

I am sort of surprised it is not standard practice in all ORs. It is something proven to be effective and relatively inexpensive to boot.

I do seem to recall it is generally done indirectly though, since the UV light is rather unpleasant to the unprotected human eye.
 
petersonra said:
It sounds like someone had a good idea that someone else tried to implement on the cheap.

UV lights for disinfection is becoming pretty common in ORs. It has a proven history of very substantially reducing post surgical infection rates.

I am sort of surprised it is not standard practice in all ORs. It is something proven to be effective and relatively inexpensive to boot.

I do seem to recall it is generally done indirectly though, since the UV light is rather unpleasant to the unprotected human eye.
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Not only unpleasant, but harmful to the retina.

UV is degrading to many things, especially paints, plastic, insulation, etc. So I would be leery of modifying a fixture not just because it would violate the fixture's original rating, but it would be hard to predict what would be the long-term consequences.

So guess what the next danger in hospitals will be: UV resistant bugs!:D
 
It seems it must depend on the quantity of ultraviolet rays?

You guys don't remember 'black lights'?

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weressl said:
So guess what the next danger in hospitals will be: UV resistant bugs!:D
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The mechanism by which UV kills pathogens is to disintegrate their cellular walls. Not much chance of them developing an immunity to that.
 
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