NEC 2023 gfci requirements?

[Karadjgne]

Could somebody please explain exactly why All equipment in a kitchen, and that includes wall ovens and refrigerators, now requires gfci protection? All I got from my local inspector was 'it's in the new code, so you have to do it'. If the equipment was good, I'd not have issue with this, but there's a lot of older equipment and especially things like washing machines with lcd/led controls that are not gfci compliant and it's frustrating to tell homeowners that I can't change out the breaker.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Could somebody please explain exactly why All equipment in a kitchen, and that includes wall ovens and refrigerators, now requires gfci protection? All I got from my local inspector was 'it's in the new code, so you have to do it'. If the equipment was good, I'd not have issue with this, but there's a lot of older equipment and especially things like washing machines with lcd/led controls that are not gfci compliant and it's frustrating to tell homeowners that I can't change out the breaker.

Have not heard about washing machines having issues with GFCIs before.

 

[Karadjgne]

Yes, many new washers have an actuator that locks the lid closed. Soon as the 'Start' button is pushed, it closes and being DC voltage, grounds through the actuator frame to the washer frame, and gfci's can pick up on that and call it a ground fault. Most brands this can be solved by use of a dual purpose breaker, but not all. Many homes a few years old used a gfci outlet as a laundry outlet, ending in the washer outlet.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Yes, many new washers have an actuator that locks the lid closed. Soon as the 'Start' button is pushed, it closes and being DC voltage, grounds through the actuator frame to the washer frame, and gfci's can pick up on that and call it a ground fault. Most brands this can be solved by use of a dual purpose breaker, but not all. Many homes a few years old used a gfci outlet as a laundry outlet, ending in the washer outlet.

How does a GFCI sense a ground fault on the load side of a DC power supply?

 

[ptonsparky]

Inductive kickback?

 

[electrofelon]

Could somebody please explain exactly why All equipment in a kitchen, and that includes wall ovens and refrigerators, now requires gfci protection?

There has been very little substantiation for many of the expanded GFCI requirements. There was a death from a shock from an outdoor HVAC unit, but the problem was a an absent or improper EGC.

 

[curt swartz]

Yes, many new washers have an actuator that locks the lid closed. Soon as the 'Start' button is pushed, it closes and being DC voltage, grounds through the actuator frame to the washer frame, and gfci's can pick up on that and call it a ground fault. Most brands this can be solved by use of a dual purpose breaker, but not all. Many homes a few years old used a gfci outlet as a laundry outlet, ending in the washer outlet.

Do you mean Dual Function Breaker? If so how would that solve a GFCI tripping issue? A DF breaker is a GFCI with AFCI protection.

If you are installing a GFCI receptacle maybe the brand of GFCI you are using is not liking something about the machine?

It really doesn't make sense to install a GFCI receptacle since an AFCI breaker plus a GFCI receptacle costs more than a DF breaker.

We have not had any call backs for the hundreds of laundry circuit we have installed with DF breakers. We never install GFCI receptacles so can't provide and feedback.

 

[curt swartz]

There has been very little substantiation for many of the expanded GFCI requirements. There was a death from a shock from an outdoor HVAC unit, but the problem was a an absent or improper EGC.

Apparently the CMP thinks the hacks that have no business doing electrical work and cutting corners will be willing to spend that extra $100+ on a GFCI breaker.