NEC 210.70(A)(2)(3) Stairway landing.

[Bjenks]

Had a client change a bonus room door above the garage from an inward swing to an outward swing. Now when you open the door, the door blocks the existing stair landing switch. The solution seems to be to just flip the switch to the other side of the door wall (inside). My question is, is there a maximum distance a light switch for stairs can be from the top step? Does it have to be immediately at the top step or can it be on the other side of a doorway? I am thinking this is fine, but just want to make sure the door doesn't somehow not make it a "floor level" or "landing level" for an interior stairway. The other side of the door is a hallway, and the stair landing is just enough room for the door swing.

 

[Sea Nile]

I love questions like this, it gives me a chance to try to locate the answer in the NEC. Great practice for an aspiring electrician...

210.70 (A) (2) (3) It's not clear, but my vote is it needs to be readily accessible from the landing. So I would guess it must be able to be turned on if the door to the bonus room was closed and locked.

 

[Sea Nile]

I love questions like this, it gives me a chance to try to locate the answer in the NEC. Great practice for an aspiring electrician...

210.70 (A) (2) (3) It's not clear, but my vote is it needs to be readily accessible from the landing. So I would guess it must be able to be turned on if the door to the bonus room was closed and locked.

With the exception could you not just put a motion detector on the ceiling at the top of the stairs?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

There is no code on location of the switch as long as there is one at top and bottom to light the stairs. I am sure someone is thinking it doesn't have to be a 3 way-- I get it but I am not going there

 

[Sea Nile]

There is no code on location of the switch as long as there is one at top and bottom to light the stairs. I am sure someone is thinking it doesn't have to be a 3 way-- I get it but I am not going there

Playing devil's advocate, strictly reading the code. What you say is true. It does not specify the wall mounted control device has to be in the stairway. It only has to be at the same floor level. Considering that, wouldn't it be acceptable to put the light switch on the opposite side of the house, or 30,000 square foot mansion? I agree the code allows it the way it's written. I should propose a code change to state the switch must be located in the stairwell.

 

[Bjenks]

With the exception could you not just put a motion detector on the ceiling at the top of the stairs?

There is actually going to be a Lutron Caseta switch and occupancy sensor, but that doesn't take away from the question. Also to be clear there is a three-way switch at the bottom in the garage. Also if I switch it to the other side, the switch will be in fact on the locked door side of the bonus room. I actually think this is a better location for the switch, so you can turn the stair light on before you open the door and off once you are inside. However, the door would now separate the switch and the landing, even though it is only 4" further away than it was before. The outward door swing is going out to the landing.

 

[Sea Nile]

There is actually going to be a Lutron Caseta switch and occupancy sensor, but that doesn't take away from the question. Also to be clear there is a three-way switch at the bottom in the garage. Also if I switch it to the other side, the switch will be in fact on the locked door side of the bonus room. I actually think this is a better location for the switch, so you can turn the stair light on before you open the door and off once you are inside. However, the door would now separate the switch and the landing, even though it is only 4" further away than it was before. The outward door swing is going out to the landing.

I agree with Dennis Alwon, it is currently ok to put it on the other side of the door.

 

[Sea Nile]

There is actually going to be a Lutron Caseta switch and occupancy sensor, but that doesn't take away from the question. Also to be clear there is a three-way switch at the bottom in the garage. Also if I switch it to the other side, the switch will be in fact on the locked door side of the bonus room. I actually think this is a better location for the switch, so you can turn the stair light on before you open the door and off once you are inside. However, the door would now separate the switch and the landing, even though it is only 4" further away than it was before. The outward door swing is going out to the landing.

Another thought, even if it is supposedly good per the NEC, is there a building code that prevents a door to swing outward into a landing? Seems like it might be a safety hazard. Let's supposed a smoke detector went off and everyone is running for the exit. Someone could be knocked down the stairs if another person opens the bonus room door quickly.

Edit: Why not change the landing to a 4 way switch and also have a three way in the inside of the bonus room?

 

[Bjenks]

Another thought, even if it is supposedly good per the NEC, is there a building code that prevents a door to swing outward into a landing? Seems like it might be a safety hazard. Let's supposed a smoke detector went off and everyone is running for the exit. Someone could be knocked down the stairs if another person opens the bonus room door quickly.

Edit: Why not change the landing to a 4 way switch and also have a three way in the inside of the bonus room?

Not a bad idea on the 4 way. door has been inspected and passed.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Playing devil's advocate, strictly reading the code. What you say is true. It does not specify the wall mounted control device has to be in the stairway. It only has to be at the same floor level. Considering that, wouldn't it be acceptable to put the light switch on the opposite side of the house, or 30,000 square foot mansion? I agree the code allows it the way it's written. I should propose a code change to state the switch must be located in the stairwell.

Yes it is compliant however you will never get another job if you did stuff like that.

Btw, if the homeowner wants the switch on the other side just add a Caseta switch as mentioned above.