Neutral and Ground seperation

[dwellselectric]

Okay question I am not agreeing with the way my boss puts his panels together and maybe you guys could tell me your opinion. Well when he does his neutrals and grounds he pairs them up like for each circuit the neutral and ground will go under the same screw. I like to seperate my grounds and neutrals I know its not required unless its a sub but what do you guys like to do and why?

 

[stickboy1375]

Basically this shows that you can only have 1 wire under a screw unless identified...

 

[dwellselectric]

ummm i dont get that post lol that is not what i was asking but thank you lol

 

[stickboy1375]

Well when he does his neutrals and grounds he pairs them up like for each circuit the neutral and ground will go under the same screw.

You asked if two wires can go under a screw.. I'm showing you a violation... If you said he just pairs them up and lands them next to each other well thats different...

 

[dwellselectric]

lol no that is not what i was asking lol. i was asking what do you guys do when you make up a panel like for "each circuit do you pair up the neutral and ground 14 and 12 awg

 

[stickboy1375]

I get what your asking, but I just wanted to point out what you typed....

For what your asking, this is what I do, all the wires that enter the left side of the cabinet get terminated on the left side, all the wires on the right side get terminated on the right side, I just don't like the looks of the wires crossing over... and if its a sub-panel I usually just install two ground bars one for each side so again I don't have to cross over...

 

[dwellselectric]

interesting i like that

 

[wireman71]

I think everyone is missing the fact that he is saying that his boss lands the grnds and neutrals under the same screw connection on the bus bar and he is wondering if this is ok. I'm not going to speculate whether it is ok or not.

 

[dwellselectric]

Wireman I was asking people how they did it and I do do it the way I want to do it

 

[1793]

Okay question I am not agreeing with the way my boss puts his panels together and maybe you guys could tell me your opinion. Well when he does his neutrals and grounds he pairs them up like for each circuit the neutral and ground will go under the same screw. I like to seperate my grounds and neutrals I know its not required unless its a sub but what do you guys like to do and why?

Basically this shows that you can only have 1 wire under a screw unless identified...

ummm i dont get that post lol that is not what i was asking but thank you lol

I don't follow Stick answered what you typed.

 

[LarryFine]

The OP is saying that his boss places the neutral and the EGC from each cable into the same hole. That is a violation unless the panel labeling states otherwise.

Even if permitted, the labeling may differentiate between neutrals and EGCs. In other words, it's possible that multiple EGC's per hole are allowed while multiple neutrals are not.

My preference is one conductor per hole, period. However, if labeling permits, I don't mind doubling up EGC's, but I still prefer single neutrals.

In a pinch, you can always group and pigtail EGC's as long as the pigtail is at least as large as the largest EGC in the bundle.

 

[winnie]

408.21 applies. Each grounded conductor shall terminate within the panelboard in an _individual_ terminal that is not also used for another conductor.

-Jon

 

[brian john]

Then again what he is saying is his boss lands them side by side and the poster wants them separated on different rows or termination bars, in either case it has been answered both ways.

One way is wrong unless the equipment is listed for the double conductors.

And the other method (I mentioned) is personal preference.

 

[radiopet]

I will add that you could simply tell your boss to view 2002 NEC - 408.21 or 2005 NEC - 408.41 and it will answer his question of can he put Grounded and EGC's under the same terminal on the buss bar....should answer that one easy enough.

I think the image has been shown enough regarding it and it's violation so wont add the picture yet again....

 

[dnem]

post #8
I think everyone is missing the fact that he is saying that his boss lands the grnds and neutrals under the same screw connection on the bus bar and he is wondering if this is ok. I'm not going to speculate whether it is ok or not.

You don?t have to speculate, it?s definitely not allowed 408.41.

post #11
My preference is one conductor per hole, period. However, if labeling permits, I don't mind doubling up EGC's, but I still prefer single neutrals.

Your preference is required by code

David

 

[LarryFine]

Your preference is required by code

As it should be! :wink:

 

[macmikeman]

At some point in the past, I posted a link to a listed split bolt for 3 conductors. No time this morning to relocate either the post or the name of the bug.