neutral to ground screw

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normbac

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Home owner got a permit to replace all his outlets he had two wire no eg I assumed he did the work himself ?
inspector wrote him up, so he called me to fix the problem. The card read hook neutral to green screw on outlets with jumper wire.
Didnt know whether to laugh or cry. Told him to talk to the head inspector and walked out. I am going to call the chief inspector myself to make sure this guy gets spanked before he kills someone.
 
& You haven't had that moment (theirs is in writing) that you had to say Wait a minute! If not then, your not human. MO.

I hope Everyone takes a moment in our Line of Work ...
 
normbac said:
..........Didnt know whether to laugh or cry. Told him to talk to the head inspector and walked out. I am going to call the chief inspector myself to make sure this guy gets spanked before he kills someone.
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Good move. Training in basic electricity and basic NEC interpretation will make a nice re-start for this "inspector". :)
 
I always hate seeing people gloat about the inspector being wrong. Many of us on this forum are Master electricians who have dedicated most of our lives to this proffesion, and often we do not agree on just what the Book says. Many inspectors are not electrical proffesionals. They have a base of knowlege that is very limited. It is, I believe, our duty to help to educate them. We are after all, on the same side.
 
iaov said:
........ Many inspectors are not electrical professionals. They have a base of knowlege that is very limited. .............
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It is not my intent to gloat, that's for sure. My point is that if a person holds himself/herself out to be an electrical inspection professional, then that person should increase their knowledge to the level of competent. How can an inspector do his/her job and take on a professional responsibility without the dedication to become educated on the most basic and fundamental aspects of the trade?

Directing someone to jumper the grounded conductor to the equipment grounding terminal on a two-wire receptacle is nothing short of negligence.:smile:
 
wbalsam1 said:
It is not my intent to gloat, that's for sure. My point is that if a person holds himself/herself out to be an electrical inspection professional, then that person should increase their knowledge to the level of competent. How can an inspector do his/her job and take on a professional responsibility without the dedication to become educated on the most basic and fundamental aspects of the trade?
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That is true of electricians, engineers, architects, well, any true professional!

I personally have had inspectors that were wrong before, and I pointed out the section of code I used to make me right. I consider the inspector to be a great inspector, not only because of his reputation or attitude, but because he went and read that section of code. That shows me he is a true professional.:cool:
 
DanZ said:
That is true of electricians, engineers, architects, well, any true professional!

I personally have had inspectors that were wrong before, and I pointed out the section of code I used to make me right. I consider the inspector to be a great inspector, not only because of his reputation or attitude, but because he went and read that section of code. That shows me he is a true professional.:cool:
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The training and skills necessary to become a good electrical inspector do not come easily. Reading extensively and attending educational forums is a real must. An inspector has to work hard to obtain an acceptable level of expertise.
One of my first inspectors, many years ago, used to say "This book is made for both of us to read and understand." He was fair, consistent, competent and thorough. I learned a lot from him.
 
wbalsam1 said:
Directing someone to jumper the grounded conductor to the equipment grounding terminal on a two-wire receptacle is nothing short of negligence.:smile:
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In fact, it's sheer lunacy. Imagine, he's being told to do what is in reality a try-to-fool-the-inspector move, by the inspector himself. Unbelievable! :roll:

It reminds me of one of my cats. She looks away while pushing a ball, and then chases it like she had nothing to do with its rolling across the floor. :cool:
 
wbalsam1 said:
The training and skills necessary to become a good electrical inspector do not come easily. Reading extensively and attending educational forums is a real must. An inspector has to work hard to obtain an acceptable level of expertise.
One of my first inspectors, many years ago, used to say "This book is made for both of us to read and understand." He was fair, consistent, competent and thorough. I learned a lot from him.
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This is a very true statement and for some jurisdictions this training is very hard to come by. I already have 28 hours of traning just for the month of September, because my city is very willing to send us. I just got back from a four day IAEI Southwestern Section Meeting. It's invaluable that we get together and learn from others or teach others as the case may be. I wish that we could see more contactors at these meetings, I know that time is money, but the contractors that I talk to will tell you that dollar for dollar, the IAEI is some of the best training you will get.
 
cowboyjwc said:
.......... I just got back from a four day IAEI Southwestern Section Meeting. It's invaluable that we get together and learn from others or teach others as the case may be. I wish that we could see more contractors at these meetings, I know that time is money, but the contractors that I talk to will tell you that dollar for dollar, the IAEI is some of the best training you will get.
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I used to attend the Eastern Section IAEI meetings and was an inspector member of the IAEI for over 20 years. I advanced through the chairs at our regional Chapter and became Chairman of the Executive Board.
Back many years ago, the local Chapter was staffed with very capable inspector and non-inspector members and training took place in all corners of the Chapters' designated region. Very knowledgeable people in the industry would make in-depth presentations. Learning was abundant.

But, New York State is a state in which 3rd party electrical inspection agencies abound, and the competition for the available seats on the E-board of the IAEI became so intense that qualifications went right out the window. If you were a favorite boy of your company and your company was entrenched in the local Chapter, you were in. Regardless of competency. When the Board became staffed with people who couldn't make adequate presentations, but went ahead and tried anyway, it wasn't long before the attendance at presentations dropped and membership dropped, too.

The I.O. really couldn't do much. I dropped out a couple of years back, out of pure frustration. I still believe in the greater whole of IAEI, just discouraged with locals. Glad to hear yours is doing well. :smile:
 
Iaei

Iaei

I've been a member of IAEI almost as long as I've been licensed (since 2006). I work for a county school board. Our work is not inspected, with two exceptions:
  1. New or replaced service entrance (required by POCO)
  2. by a State Fire Marshal (as part of yearly safety inspections)

We have to "self inspect" so I seek out training. I've found the training at the WV division (or what ever it is called) of the Ohio chapter to be excellent. We have two one day seminars a year on useful topics, updates from the POCO and the Fire Marshall. The presentations are from experienced inspectors or manufacturing reps. The next one is on PV from the guy who wrote the code chapter.

We also attend the 3 day Ohio yearly meeting and get presentations from members of the code panels.

I'm a code-wonk. I'm also an ADA requirements wonk.

/s/ Jim Williams
 
I belong to the Western Section of the IAEI and the Reciprocal Electrical Council Inc of Southeastern Michigan and educational programs are great.
 
I called the inspector today to try and talk this through turned out he was a supervisor he was very stubborn rude actually he said the citation was for the gfi in the bathroom and kitchen since they would not trip(open ground) he wanted either a neutral to ground option 2 take the neutral in the panel and tap it over to the eg ??? (didnt want to go there) or remove the gfi and put the 2 prong outlet back in or he would not sign off on it. More confused now, do I let it go or? will gladly give the name and number if an inspector from this forum wants to call him I think he would listen to a fellow inspector maybe. Its hard to stop thinking about this, even with out being hired for the job.
 
normbac said:
I called the inspector today to try and talk this through turned out he was a supervisor he was very stubborn rude actually he said the citation was for the gfi in the bathroom and kitchen since they would not trip(open ground) he wanted either a neutral to ground option 2 take the neutral in the panel and tap it over to the eg ??? (didnt want to go there) or remove the gfi and put the 2 prong outlet back in or he would not sign off on it. More confused now, do I let it go or? will gladly give the name and number if an inspector from this forum wants to call him I think he would listen to a fellow inspector maybe. Its hard to stop thinking about this, even with out being hired for the job.
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This inspector doesn't understand how a GFCI works, obviously. A GFCI will operate without a EGC. What it won't do is trip with a plug-in tester. As long as the test button on the GFCI works, you are good to go.

Check out this thread. I know it is long, but well worth the read.
 
normbac said:
I called the inspector today to try and talk this through turned out he was a supervisor he was very stubborn rude actually he said the citation was for the gfi in the bathroom and kitchen since they would not trip(open ground) he wanted either a neutral to ground option 2 take the neutral in the panel and tap it over to the eg ??? (didnt want to go there) or remove the gfi and put the 2 prong outlet back in or he would not sign off on it. More confused now, do I let it go or? will gladly give the name and number if an inspector from this forum wants to call him I think he would listen to a fellow inspector maybe. Its hard to stop thinking about this, even with out being hired for the job.
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Find the instructions for the GFCI, send them to the inspector.
 
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