New circuits behind commerical bar -- GFCI?

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lordofpi

lordofpi

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New Jersey
I've just contracted a job running new branch circuits behind the bar (not within customer reach) of a local house of libations. The circuits are to service dedicated appliances only: 6 beer coolers and 2 cash registers. All appliances are 120 V. The floor behind the bar is and will remain painted concrete. There are 3 sets of triple sinks in various locations behind the bar and the closest any receptacle will come to a sink is about 8 feet.

Is GFCI (or possibly GFP) in order in this scenario? The NEC is fairly vague about commerical and industrial aspects of its ground-fault rulings. I know about the requirements of "wet bars" for residential and "kitchens" for commercial, but this seems to be one of those gray areas.
 
lordofpi said:
this seems to be one of those gray areas.
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As far as the NEC is concerned I do not see any gray areas here.

The NEC does not currently require GFCI protection in this location.
 
Kind of strange that there isn't a requirement for this yet all 15 and 20 amp, 120 volt receptacles in the kitchen behind the bar would be required to be GFCI protected. Also, GFPE is only for equipment protection due to it's higher (30ma) trip rating.
 
The establishment already has a few receptacles scattered about back there behind the bar, and I am wondering if I ought to advise them on using GFCI for these. They are not dedicated outlets, but I'm sure that at some point there is a bartender using them for a cellular phone charger or some other usage that would be equally out-of-place. I can just see a device like this getting dropped into a filled wash-sink. I know that life cannot be idiot-proof, but I'm curious on how you all would advise the client regarding this situation.
It's kind of like the old adage, "If you build it, they will come." If you install a receptacle, they will use it. ;)
 
Visited a bar recently. The issue was that the kitchen equipment subpanel would open its main periodically. (Turned out to be a broken ice maker.) Their dining and bar registers were part of an electronic POS system in the office, connected with enet. Every terminal has its own battery backup, and each receptacle feeding the terminal, printer and card scanner has a UPS. Even so, the single station which was powered from the kitchen would make everything reboot, causing their entire operation to come to a halt.

If you put in something which needs the reset button pushed at 10:30 Friday night, for any reason, my guess is that it just wouldn't happen.

Without knowing the place, my gut level tells me... Be nice and give them regular 5/15s.
 
peteo said:
Visited a bar recently. The issue was that the kitchen equipment subpanel would open its main periodically. (Turned out to be a broken ice maker.) Their dining and bar registers were part of an electronic POS system in the office, connected with enet. Every terminal has its own battery backup, and each receptacle feeding the terminal, printer and card scanner has a UPS. Even so, the single station which was powered from the kitchen would make everything reboot, causing their entire operation to come to a halt.

If you put in something which needs the reset button pushed at 10:30 Friday night, for any reason, my guess is that it just wouldn't happen.

Without knowing the place, my gut level tells me... Be nice and give them regular 5/15s.
Click to expand...


Ha ha, bars and restaurants are funny places. I don't need to worry about that scenario in this place, however. They are still using National Cash Register Model #22 registers. These are the old ones that you saw in bars in the fifties and sixties. If the power goes down, they still can use the original cranks that came with the register to hand-crank and transaction.
 
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