Night Light Required on Retail Sales Floor

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Ravenvalor

Ravenvalor

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Piedmont region of NC
Hello,

Can someone please point out a code reference stating that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space? Art. 210.70 does not specify.

Thanks,
 
Ravenvalor said:
Hello,

Can someone please point out a code reference stating that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space? Art. 210.70 does not specify.

Thanks,
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I've heard of fire departments wanting a switchable light in every occupancy so that if they go in when it's dark they can flip a switch, but I don't have a code reference for you. With BMS's it makes their job tougher with lighting being controlled from across the country.
 
If there is such a requirement it is not from the NEC.

Many places want some minimal lighting anyway during off hours, it generally is a compliment to security, especially if there are windows where people outside could see what is going on if someone is there that shouldn't be there.
 
Ravenvalor said:
Hello,

Can someone please point out a code reference stating that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space? Art. 210.70 does not specify.

Thanks,
Click to expand...

Depending on where the retail space is located will dictate the means of egress required by International Building Code chapter 10.
 
Ravenvalor said:
Hello,

Can someone please point out a code reference stating that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space? Art. 210.70 does not specify.

Thanks,
Click to expand...
It is most likely a local code.
 
Gregg Harris said:
Depending on where the retail space is located will dictate the means of egress required by International Building Code chapter 10.
Click to expand...

Egress lighting can be shut down when the building is unoccupied.


As the others have said it is not an NEC rule and I have done tons of retail that all the lighting is shut down at night ..... Including egress and exit signs.
 
iwire said:
Egress lighting can be shut down when the building is unoccupied.


As the others have said it is not an NEC rule and I have done tons of retail that all the lighting is shut down at night ..... Including egress and exit signs.
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True.
What I should have posted is that it would be an amendment to chapter 10 in IBC for the jurisdiction in question.
 
mgookin said:
I've heard of fire departments wanting a switchable light in every occupancy so that if they go in when it's dark they can flip a switch, but I don't have a code reference for you. With BMS's it makes their job tougher with lighting being controlled from across the country.
Click to expand...

I find that to be somewhat pointless if you consider that in a fire call one of the first things they usually want to do is turn off the power to the facility.
 
kwired said:
I find that to be somewhat pointless if you consider that in a fire call one of the first things they usually want to do is turn off the power to the facility.
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Although for a simple smoke alarm confined to one sensor zone they may well want to take a look first before killing all the power. :)
If they see flames shooting out, they may not need much in the way of light anyway. :happyno:
I do agree that they are likely to carry their own independent light sources in either case.
 
kwired said:
I find that to be somewhat pointless if you consider that in a fire call one of the first things they usually want to do is turn off the power to the facility.
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Interestingly most of the time when we have a job where all the lighting shutdown when unoccupied activation of the fire alarm will turn them on.

I think Golddigger nailed it, in larger buildings they are not so fast to kill the service over an issue confined to one area.
 
If fire dept responds to an automatic call by the alarm system and the owner or his representative doesn't also show up then they likely have to either break in or wait for someone to show up to let them in. Or maybe with enough integration of systems they security system will let them in if there is a fire alarm, as well as turn on at least some minimal lighting.

I guess my point is if there is someone there, turning on lights may not be too big of an issue, if the place has a big blaze in progress - the lights probably do not matter and they actually would be more concerned with removal of all power sources.
 
kwired said:
If fire dept responds to an automatic call by the alarm system and the owner or his representative doesn't also show up then they likely have to either break in or wait for someone to show up to let them in.
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Around here many / most commercial buildings are required to provide an accessible 'Knox Box' which is a key vault that only the FD has keys to. The keys to the building have to be in the box. They are often tied to the security system so an security alarm will be generated when the box is opened.

I guess my point is if there is someone there, turning on lights may not be too big of an issue,
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Turning on the lights in many commercial buildings can be difficult to impossible if you do not know how.

Could you find the 'light switch' at a Walmart?
 
iwire said:
...

Could you find the 'light switch' at a Walmart?
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That switch is in Bentonville, AR.

When the economic crash started here, almost all developers turned their commercial projects into shell permits. The only stipulation was the fire dep't wanted one light inside that works with a switch near the front door. Other than that they don't even need a roof on it. Where did the Fire Dept get the authority to mandate that? I don't know; maybe they didn't. But there's always that one sentence in every code "When in the opinion of the AHJ extenuating conditions exist..."
 
iwire said:
Could you find the 'light switch' at a Walmart?
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Wal Mart is open 24/7 around here, the lights are never off - if nothing is wrong with them anyway. Now the newer stores do have skylights and auto dimming if natural light is sufficient, but unless there is a failure you are still not in a completely dark store.:p


Around here many / most commercial buildings are required to provide an accessible 'Knox Box' which is a key vault that only the FD has keys to. The keys to the building have to be in the box. They are often tied to the security system so an security alarm will be generated when the box is opened.
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That is something that just doesn't happen much around here, but I am in a rural area. Chances are if there is a fire in a business around here someone that works at that business, or has before, is also a volunteer firefighter. There may be some way to get into specific places like schools should they be called automatically by the alarm system. Hospitals will have someone there 24/7, many other businesses will not have an alarm, or at least one that doesn't call fire dept. Security systems are becoming more popular though and some may go through some private security company for notification. Otherwise if no automation involved and if nobody was there, the place is probably obviously on fire before it is noticed and breaking in is not much of a concern at that point.
 
Ravenvalor said:
Hello,

Can someone please point out a code reference stating that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space? Art. 210.70 does not specify.

Thanks,
Click to expand...

It looks like the answer to your question is No.

We can not point out a code reference which states that there must be either an accessible light switch or a night light on the sales floor of a retail space.

You can check with the local AHJ for amendments and/ or interpretations.
 
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