outdoor hot tub

[nizak]

Haven't done a new tub install in several years.Are the bonding requirements the same as a pool as far as if the unit is going to sit on a newly poured concrete pad?

3' beyond tub perimeter
Wire mesh or #8 solid CU conductor

Do not have my code book with me at the time.Remember pool requirements but not tubs.

Thanks.

 

[kwired]

680.42(B) 2014NEC:

(B) Bonding.
Bonding by metal-to-metal mounting on a common frame or base shall be permitted. The metal bands or hoops used to secure wooden staves shall not be required to be bonded as required in 680.26.
Equipotential bonding of perimeter surfaces in accordance with 680.26(B)(2) shall not be required to be provided for spas and hot tubs where all of the following conditions apply:
The spa or hot tub shall be listed as a self-contained spa for aboveground use.
The spa or hot tub shall not be identified as suitable only for indoor use.
The installation shall be in accordance with the manufacturer?s instructions and shall be located on or above grade.
The top rim of the spa or hot tub shall be at least 710 mm (28 in.) above all perimeter surfaces that are within 760 mm (30 in.), measured horizontally from the spa or hot tub. The height of nonconductive external steps for entry to or exit from the self-contained spa shall not be used to reduce or increase this rim height measurement

Format did not copy quite right - but the information is there. This covers a lot of the packaged spas that are out there.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

680.42(B) 2014NEC:



Format did not copy quite right - but the information is there. This covers a lot of the packaged spas that are out there.

That is only for the 2014 NEC or if the area that the op lives in has accepted the TIA

 

[kwired]

That is only for the 2014 NEC or if the area that the op lives in has accepted the TIA

Correct. The TIA was for 2011 NEC, and leaves us with mostly the same requirement that was printed in 2014.

If you are using the 2008 or earlier you still had similar basic requirements.

2011 they made some changes and came up with a situation they hadn't anticipated and the reason for the TIA. I would need to did a little deeper to give all details but IIRC had to do with a change stating that outdoor spa's needed to follow requirements of art 680 part II for permanently installed pools, which does require bonding perimeter surfaces. This required perimeter bonding of something that was not all that conductive in many cases and to run a bonding conductor to such surface was deemed pointless.

 

[Sierrasparky]

Correct. The TIA was for 2011 NEC, and leaves us with mostly the same requirement that was printed in 2014.

If you are using the 2008 or earlier you still had similar basic requirements.

2011 they made some changes and came up with a situation they hadn't anticipated and the reason for the TIA. I would need to did a little deeper to give all details but IIRC had to do with a change stating that outdoor spa's needed to follow requirements of art 680 part II for permanently installed pools, which does require bonding perimeter surfaces. This required perimeter bonding of something that was not all that conductive in many cases and to run a bonding conductor to such surface was deemed pointless.

I see that 2011 states spas and hot tub use 680 parts I and IV. Am I missing something?:?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I see that 2011 states spas and hot tub use 680 parts I and IV. Am I missing something?:?

There was a TIA issued during the 2011 code cycle that is basically what you see in the 2014 NEC. If your area has adopted that TIA then you can use it otherwise you still would need the perimeter bond for the tub

 

[Sierrasparky]

There was a TIA issued during the 2011 code cycle that is basically what you see in the 2014 NEC. If your area has adopted that TIA then you can use it otherwise you still would need the perimeter bond for the tub

What section are you refrencing to "perimeter Bonding"?
If you are speaking of 680.26 B 2 :that is in part II which is not code for packaged spas and hot tubs in the Calif edition of 2011 NEC.

 

[texie]

What section are you refrencing to "perimeter Bonding"?
If you are speaking of 680.26 B 2 :that is in part II which is not code for packaged spas and hot tubs in the Calif edition of 2011 NEC.

Yes, but 680.42 in the 2011 NEC stated that an outdoor spa or hot tub had to comply with Part II. There was no provision to omit the EP bonding. The TIA fixed that for 2011 and it was incorporated into 680.42(B) for the 2014 edition.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Yes, but 680.42 in the 2011 NEC stated that an outdoor spa or hot tub had to comply with Part II. There was no provision to omit the EP bonding. The TIA fixed that for 2011 and it was incorporated into 680.42(B) for the 2014 edition.

Thank you for answering that for me.... :thumbsup:. Alot of people did not realize that a hot tub was suppose to follow part II and they ignored the perimeter bonding

 

[Sierrasparky]

Yes, but 680.42 in the 2011 NEC stated that an outdoor spa or hot tub had to comply with Part II. There was no provision to omit the EP bonding. The TIA fixed that for 2011 and it was incorporated into 680.42(B) for the 2014 edition.

I did miss that one.
I had almost thought that using NM for the feeder in the inside portion was a no go too.