Overhead Power Lines Dangerous To Life and Property

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mbrooke

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I don't think its safe hanging expansive, lethal objects on wooden poles expecting them not come down, shower sparks, energize pedestrian accessible objects like fences, or drive high voltage into buildings. Perhaps they need to go underground?

Videos like this show the latent hazards coming to fruition imo:



 

mbrooke

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United States
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You have a thing about putting stuff underground. Sadly, I think few share your passion no matter how many videos you post.

After being through to-many-to count whether related power outages, property owners refusing to trim trees, case reports of electrocutions and home fires, plus having seen plenty of downed lines arcing away after a storm my opinion has been swayed toward burial.

Storms are becoming more frequent, and I think it no longer makes sense having to rebuild miles of distro after every hurricane or storm.
 

Hv&Lv

Senior Member
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-
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Engineer/Technician
After being through to-many-to count whether related power outages, property owners refusing to trim trees, case reports of electrocutions and home fires, plus having seen plenty of downed lines arcing away after a storm my opinion has been swayed toward burial.

Storms are becoming more frequent, and I think it no longer makes sense having to rebuild miles of distro after every hurricane or storm.

Who should pay to bury these lines, and how are you going to account for the thousands of hours of outage times for additions such as cutting in transformers and dig ins?
And where and how have you seen plenty of downed lines arcing after a storm with no job?
I’ve been in utility and electrical work for 30+ years, and construction before that. I have never seen but about three lines laying arcing. One was on a rock, one was tree wire, the other was in tall right of way.
 

mbrooke

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Technician
Who should pay to bury these lines, and how are you going to account for the thousands of hours of outage times for additions such as cutting in transformers and dig ins?
And where and how have you seen plenty of downed lines arcing after a storm with no job?
I’ve been in utility and electrical work for 30+ years, and construction before that. I have never seen but about three lines laying arcing. One was on a rock, one was tree wire, the other was in tall right of way.


Those paying the bills.

It won't be over night, but gradually over a 150 year period.

With things like service changes and conductors at the same phase angle, theoretically outages can be reduced or eliminated.

You mustn't get out much. Go drive around after a major storm, you'll see a few. Been luckily to get one on my street years back.

When the repudiation complex comes out, it means I'm right 😃
 
Mbrooke, you need to do more critical thinking here. Just because you see some videos on youtube doesnt mean this is a common chronic problem that needs to be "fixed". I honestly cant remember the last time I saw or even heard of downed wires in my area. Not only that, around here, it would be pretty near impossible to put the wires underground due to the scattered easements and constant zig zagging across roads here (there is usually no public ROW along the side of roads for utilities here, its almost all easements).
 

mbrooke

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Technician
Mbrooke, you need to do more critical thinking here. Just because you see some videos on youtube doesnt mean this is a common chronic problem that needs to be "fixed". I honestly cant remember the last time I saw or even heard of downed wires in my area. Not only that, around here, it would be pretty near impossible to put the wires underground due to the scattered easements and constant zig zagging across roads here (there is usually no public ROW along the side of roads for utilities here, its almost all easements).



That would be ignoring tropical storm Irene, the 2011 October snow storm, the 2013 snow storm, Hurricane Sandy, tropical storm Iasis, two dozen wind/rain events, and several ice storms that between New Jersey, New York State and New England have on average have left 3 million customers without power for 7 days.

I understand I'm challenging patriotic exceptionalism, however, the facts are becoming rather compelling.
 

romex jockey

Senior Member
Location
Vermont
Occupation
electrician
Much of the NE rural contingent is REP (rural electrification program) vintage , and much of it is condemned , local poco's employ a small red metal icon nailed @ eye level, plugs @ ankle level indicate rot prevention, along with whatever other bandaids.

A good amount of it all waits for our trade to upgrade an UG system, in order to project costs to the receiving customers ......

Any storm will usually result in outages here

Antiquated poco infrastructure being the number one reason for genny sales.

~RJ~
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Mbrooke, you need to do more critical thinking here. Just because you see some videos on youtube doesnt mean this is a common chronic problem that needs to be "fixed". I honestly cant remember the last time I saw or even heard of downed wires in my area. Not only that, around here, it would be pretty near impossible to put the wires underground due to the scattered easements and constant zig zagging across roads here (there is usually no public ROW along the side of roads for utilities here, its almost all easements).
I agree, in many areas it would be an impossible task that no one would want to pay for due to the staggering cost. The best we can do at this point is require that any new areas of development must put everything underground.
 

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
Those paying the bills.

It won't be over night, but gradually over a 150 year period.

With things like service changes and conductors at the same phase angle, theoretically outages can be reduced or eliminated.

You mustn't get out much. Go drive around after a major storm, you'll see a few. Been luckily to get one on my street years back.

When the repudiation complex comes out, it means I'm right 😃
The way they are pushing solar, we will not need distribution lines in 150 years! LOL!
But then they say we all will be dead from “climate change” in ten years anyway, so does it really matter?
 
Yes they are.
You need to do more critical thinking about who and how many people say such things. There are always a few wackos out there that say almost anything, like murder should be legal or I should be able to marry my lawn mower or Biden and a few secret service agents are going to show up at my house and take my guns and dump out my garbage can to make sure I'm recycling. Yes I guarantee you could find someone who actually believes those things. That doesn't mean it has any significant mainstream following. Personally I have never heard the things that you say "people are saying".
 

paulengr

Senior Member
After being through to-many-to count whether related power outages, property owners refusing to trim trees, case reports of electrocutions and home fires, plus having seen plenty of downed lines arcing away after a storm my opinion has been swayed toward burial.

Storms are becoming more frequent, and I think it no longer makes sense having to rebuild miles of distro after every hurricane or storm.

It no longer makes sense to continue to put in weak structures. I live in a category 2 hurricane zone (120 mph wind). Lots of reasons lines fail.

NESC basically says you can IGNORE wind if the pole is 70 feet or shorter. It also assumes ASCE type “B” terrain which means you have a typical established residential neighborhood with trees and houses to break up the wind. Open fields are type “A”. If you build to an ASCE spec these problems go away. As a large mine our lines don’t fall down but the neighboring utilities do. They fall down in open fields and with poles taller than about 30 feet. Any wonder why this happens?
 

mbrooke

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Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
I agree, in many areas it would be an impossible task that no one would want to pay for due to the staggering cost. The best we can do at this point is require that any new areas of development must put everything underground.


Most new sub divisions are underground. Rarely is there an outage due to the underground portion.
 

mbrooke

Batteries Included
Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
It no longer makes sense to continue to put in weak structures. I live in a category 2 hurricane zone (120 mph wind). Lots of reasons lines fail.

NESC basically says you can IGNORE wind if the pole is 70 feet or shorter. It also assumes ASCE type “B” terrain which means you have a typical established residential neighborhood with trees and houses to break up the wind. Open fields are type “A”. If you build to an ASCE spec these problems go away. As a large mine our lines don’t fall down but the neighboring utilities do. They fall down in open fields and with poles taller than about 30 feet. Any wonder why this happens?



The codes are littered with deficiencies, as much as everyone wants to deny this.

Thank you for being honest :)
 

mbrooke

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Location
United States
Occupation
Technician
The way they are pushing solar, we will not need distribution lines in 150 years! LOL!
But then they say we all will be dead from “climate change” in ten years anyway, so does it really matter?

Not dead, just lots more flooding and power outages.
 

drcampbell

Senior Member
Location
The Motor City, Michigan USA
Occupation
Engineer

mbrooke

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Location
United States
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Technician
Stop trying to de-rail every single thing you guys refuse to admit you were wrong about regarding electricity.

I made it clear, end the politics. It has nothing to do with this discussion.
 
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