Owner Operators

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dereckbc

dereckbc

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Question to you all that do RFQ's. I am considering building my own house and being the GC, God help me!

My question is will EC bid higher than say a GC that they know and have done biz with?

I think I know the answer, but how much more are you going to stick to some one for a 1-time job?
 
O. O.

O. O.

dereckbc said:
Question to you all that do RFQ's. I am considering building my own house and being the GC, God help me!

My question is will EC bid higher than say a GC that they know and have done biz with?

I think I know the answer, but how much more are you going to stick to some one for a 1-time job?
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Your answer that you know your going to get is the right one. It's probably as you stated a one shot (poor verbiage) deal. I have pricing for repeat customers and a price one timers or those who let their fingers do the walking.
 
Just make sure you have a good vision of what you want and be sure the plans reflect that vision. It is likely you will pay much more for change orders, additions, and upgrades then you would have if they were on the original bid plans. Many contractors will bid low on custom/owner built homes with the expectation that many changes orders/upgrades will be made at much greater cost.
 
Homeowners building houses are usually a PITA(not saying you are), so in general they will recieve a higher price to deal with the added aggravation.

Usually these projects take longer to complete, decisions take longer as well.
These cost $$$

Tom
 
Look at it from this perspective. Contracting is a business and in the eyes of the EC you are in all probability a higher risk. More call backs and less knowledge and experience with scheduling a job. This adds more time and $$ like Davis9 said. Not that all contractors are that hot though. I have my stories but this one from my EC friend is the best. He arived for "rough in" and the pergo!! was down, all the kitchen cabinets were in the kitchen setting everywhere ( not installed ) and all the fixtures were setting at there locations. Remember this is rough in, no drywall yet. Good luck.
 
Derek, to present the other side, I re-wired a kitchen for a homeowner who was also the GC. We relocated a couple of receptacles and added a couple of new ones, all with new 20a homeruns.

Naturally, I mounted the new boxes at the same height as the originals. When the counter guys came in, it was found that the new backsplash was 2.5" higher, and we had to re-do the work.

The homeowner's response? "It's not my responsibility! That's why I hired professionals!" It took a conversation with his wife to convince him that job coordination IS the GC's responsibility.

We got paid. The point is to remember why GC's get paid to do what they do. It's not an easy job. Shopping for sub-contractors is not easy.
 
celtic said:
I'm not sure I understand your question :-?
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Celtic I am cutting out the General Contractor to build my home and doing it myself in an attempt to possible save some big money.

I am getting mixed opinions as to whether or not I will really save anything and that it could cost more to do it myself.

Electrical is only one part, there are many more trades involved. I am an Electrical Engineer with Licensure in the state I plan on building in, so I am confident in the bidding process.

My question really pertains to this. Since the trades do not know me, I am a one-shot job, vs say something like a custom builder who uses the same contractors over and over again. Are the various trades going to bid much higher and negating any savings I may have eliminating the GC and doing it myself?

My other thought is hiring a Building Supervisor with the contacts, but I still retain all the purse strings and decisions.
 
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LarryFine said:
Naturally, I mounted the new boxes at the same height as the originals. When the counter guys came in, it was found that the new backsplash was 2.5" higher, and we had to re-do the work.
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Larry thanks, I am aware of the changes. To prevent most of them I will be using architectural plans to avoid most of those problems, or so I hope.

Guys, don't be affraid of offending me, tell me what you think.
 
I "GC'd" my last two houses from the ground up. I believe you can save $$$, but be prepared for lots of questions. Surely you must have some contacts in the construction world, use them, or get referrals from them at least. If anything you will save the Juice that the GC adds to subs, but GC's also handle other things such as cleaning the jobsite, organizing lumber shipments, Port a John delivery etc. Be prepared for some work, but I believe it is worth it. Set your budget higher than you think. Banks usually hold back 10% to let Lien time pass at the end. It can be tough waiting out this time, cause you need the $$$ to pay everyone.

Tom
 
dereckbc said:
Guys, don't be affraid of offending me, tell me what you think.
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OK along with the great advice to have a clear and complete set of drawings I will add some.

When you choose your subs (any of them) listen to them carefully about what needs to be done before you call them to do their part of the job.

It may sound basic but it seems to always happen when I have worked with 'non GCs'. I will say don't call me until X, Y and Z are complete and they will call me back when X is complete, Y is half done and Z is not even started.

Along this same line don't let the subs do part of the job and leave you hanging, letting that happen results in what I mentioned above.

Be prepared to be tough, subs IMO will likely take advantage of you lack of overall experience. At the same time your lack of experience is likely to be costing them money due to delays and reworks. This results in a sub that just wants to be done with you and off the job, in other words they will have no interest in going above and beyond as they will feel like they already are going above and beyond.

One last thing and of course this is not necessary but surprise food brought to the job for lunch or maybe a few beers at the end of the day and some time shooting the breeze with the subs might them feel you are worth going the extra mile for.

JMHO, Good Luck it could be a satisfying endeavor. Bob
 
One other thing.

KEEP RECORDS!

Keep a record of everything, pertinent conversations and how many people are on the job each day and from what contractor.
 
General contractors are not always the smartest people in the world but they do have one thing going for them. This is how they make a living and not just a side line. They normally don't try to run a restaurant or night club while trying to finish a construction project. They can devote enough time and energy to the project to try and make it profitable.

Most homeowners can't afford to take a vacation in order to build a house because if they do thier loss of salary eats up much of the savings.

I think many people enjoy the experience of building their own homes ( once they get out of the nut house and are properly medicated ). ;)
 
When we were kids my father did exactly what you're doing -- he GC'd a handful of houses, most of which were ours. This is how I learned to scrape drywall compound off floors when I was a little girl :cool:

You can save a considerable amount of money building yourself if you have a clue what you're doing. If you don't have a clue, try and find a friend ("free") who is either a GC or has built a number of their own homes. If you get your subs lined up, building a house is a snap. If you have to dig around for subs, can't get them scheduled, have problems with materials being delivered on time, blah, blah, blah, it can drag out FOREVER and cost a lot more.
 
I roughed a kitchen/bathroom for a homeowner/GC last May (he gutted it the previous year), and he's still not ready for me to come back to trim it out. His kitchen has been unusable for close to two years now.

With homeowners who act as their own GCs, I bid them high because I know the PITA factor will also be high. Things go a lot more smoothly and a lot faster when there is an actual GC on the job who knows what he's doing.
 
jeff43222 said:
Things go a lot more smoothly and a lot faster when there is an actual GC on the job who knows what he's doing.
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I think that is partly true, but all GC I have known in residential usually have 4-to-12 jobs going at once and never at the job site.
 
If you find the right GC you will get a better job for less money than if you contract it yourself. And that doesn't even factor in your time.
Get the wrong one and you'll pay more and spend as much time as if you GC'd it yourself. Put together exactly what you want and give it to some GC's to bid. Or, find a GC you can trust. Some will do it for cost plus a %. Again, the right one will save you money over doing it yourself.

I will charge at least 20% more to work for a homeowner. Most subs I know will, too. And despite your credentials, that's what you are in this situation. I'd suggest searching for a good contractor.

Good luck.
 
The construction industry is slow right now. Get your stuff nearly ready for the rough, and get competitive bids.

You write the statement of work (what you want done) but make sure it is in all-inclusive form. You don't want to get nickled-and-dimed for little things that are really part of the contract but you didn't put on the list. One of your terms is that it must meet code. Then if the inspector rejects it, it's their problem to fix it.

They will have other contract terms that protect their interests.

Try to get a unit price for change orders in the contract. Get your bid on the basis of quantiy and unit price, and if you want 3 more receptacles, they are at the same unit price if all done at the time of rough.

Get a schedule commitment, and keep your schedule commitments. If they screw up and don't come to do the job, you must have an alternative.
 
dereckbc said:
Larry thanks, I am aware of the changes. To prevent most of them I will be using architectural plans to avoid most of those problems, or so I hope.
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Make sure that you get everything you want on the plans. Most architects are working on a percentage fee, so you want to review the plans and make sure that he has included everything.

The cost of fixing errors and omissions in the plans is usually covered by the architect. You still have to pay what it would have cost if he had gotten it right in the first place, but he pays any added cost.

Don't let anyone talk you into Time and Materials or "cost plus". You have plans certified by the architect, and you want them to build it to print and code.

The contract is as important as the drawings. You need to be protected from schedule delays caused by other subcontractors, and from default by subcontractors.

Progress payments should be made only against work accomplished, preferably certifed by the architect if he is supporting construction, and certainly no final payment until after it passes inspection. You are not a bank and should not be paying for work not yet done.
 
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