Pad-Mounted Transformer Question

[adjusterbrett]

Insurance adjuster - hoping to get some basic info prior to response form local utility (First Energy).

The Pad-Mounted Transformers around northern Ohio are encased in aluminum (rather thick). Any idea the thickness (ga or mm or in)? I did place a magnet upon it (nothing), and assume it's aluminum. Its the same green box seen almost everywhere around First Energy's realm in norther OH.

Photo of the actual one:
https://1drv.ms/i/s!At85Ik4AwvYurr558ysw_XObEy6g2Q?e=EXhEwR

Thanx in advance.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I assumed they were steel since they do tend to rust but I guess it isn't if a magnet doesn't stick to it. Why do you need this info? Wouldn't it be a better bet to go to your local power company and find out from their engineers?

 

[adjusterbrett]

Yeah - already requested a week ago - they have not responded and when I checked back in - they are having legal review the answer (why on earth, no idea, I simply asked for the thickness per MFD spec of that box). I have a rogue insurance adjuster whom is utilizing HAIL damage to this box (or the unsurprising lack there of) to deny all claims (even those that are ridiculously obvious). I know it's THICK - and I know there are only a few manufacturers of these out there (and boy was I surprised at the cost). I have been to storms with very large hail that went through roof decking - but those boxes remained unscathed, so I know he is full of it. I need something reasonably close - when I search for the item online - I'm looking at hundreds (and the mass majority are coated steel), so even a reference point would be useful. This isn't a one off - I've followed this person on near a dozen claims now - with a trail of disdain that follows his path (and rightly so). Appreciate any help anyone can offer.

 

[Elect117]

That doesn't look like a transformer. It looks likes either a small pad mounted switch or a communication's box. I can't find a shock hazard warning label. Maybe it is in the fine print on the sticker that I can't read. Either way, a common manufacturer is S&C, and they are made with steel.

PME Pad-Mounted Gear

PME Pad-Mounted Gear features elbow-connected components. Switch and fuse components are enclosed and protected within an inner air-insulated steel compartment that keeps out foliage, wildlife, and contaminants.

www.sandc.com

 

[hillbilly1]

It does look like a single phase pad mount used in residential areas, is this customer not utility owned? In a deregulated area?

 

[John A]

All the residential single phase BUD transformers that I have come upon are steel. I doubt that any utility co. would go for aluminum (cost)

Perhaps First Energy found some that are composite materials, that is why it's non-magnetic??

 

[adjusterbrett]

I've seen the inside - there are like several houses attached to it - and the 'boys' use a long (6-8 foot) pole to move the physical connection in and out - usually on the back wall of the unit... It is NOT magnetic - used both rare earth and ceramic magnets against it. It's THICK - I can easily stand on it, and she would do some damage if one was to back into it - tings like aluminum when I tap it with a metal gauge... Three more photos for you (and I think cause I was new, I didn't have the attach button). Again - appreciate the help... BTW what does "BUD" transformer stand for?

 

[rambojoe]

Id love to know why a rouge and a not rouge insurance adjuster cares about the gauge and composition of a transformer?
Is this a legal matter? Did someone hit it with a car? Or a lamn genie?!

 

[adjusterbrett]

I've got an adjuster declining claims on the basis the 2" hail didn't leave indents in the "Green Utility Box". As for me - I'm left cleaning up the mess - so I'm validating that hail would NEVER affect them. My terminology needs to be correct, and the material is needed to validate the toughness. If this was 24 gauge aluminum - it would be toast - but I'm guessing 1/4" plate that has been braked - so in that case - there isn't a fool (outside the rogue) that would even suggest it could ever be damaged. I've been to Minneapolis, Texas, and several other areas where 3 & 4" hail went through roof decking - but those boxes were not damaged - so I am sure the measly 2" stuff that fell ins't going to hurt it. As much as I'm a laymen in your world - the person whom I have to make this plea too likely doesn't know the difference between a pair of linesman pliers and a hammer. Either I get my ducks in a row - or the claimant (who filed the claim and got screwed by the rogue) gets screwed and I end up in a deposition as they will (rightly) file suit. I came here because the knowledge level - perhaps I'd be better off at a linesman forum - just didn't find any. The box itself is NOT damaged at all - and that is the point. I need to PROVE that it is made of a material that hail simply would not damage. I've searched through several distributors of these, but can only find STEEL (and this isn't) - and would prefer to actually call it by what it is often referred too. Will the rogue adjuster get fired - certainly hope so, but my responsibility falls to the carrier and claimant - and to refute the claim this box could somehow be damaged by a 2" round piece of ice. Seems easy - really seems common sense - but neither of those count for much. Just trying to learn and do what's right. I have sent the box numbers, the same google pic, the address it reside in to First Energy - with no affect.

 

[rambojoe]

To be completely subjective the first 2 sentences of your response (and thx for answering) seems unclear if you are being held responsible or not responsible for hail damage... i read it 3 times too.
Yes, hail could cause the damage and hail could not... post pics of the damage but no answer here will be definitive...
P.s. take a nice ball hammer to it, see what happens.

 

[hillbilly1]

I've got an adjuster declining claims on the basis the 2" hail didn't leave indents in the "Green Utility Box". As for me - I'm left cleaning up the mess - so I'm validating that hail would NEVER affect them. My terminology needs to be correct, and the material is needed to validate the toughness. If this was 24 gauge aluminum - it would be toast - but I'm guessing 1/4" plate that has been braked - so in that case - there isn't a fool (outside the rogue) that would even suggest it could ever be damaged. I've been to Minneapolis, Texas, and several other areas where 3 & 4" hail went through roof decking - but those boxes were not damaged - so I am sure the measly 2" stuff that fell ins't going to hurt it. As much as I'm a laymen in your world - the person whom I have to make this plea too likely doesn't know the difference between a pair of linesman pliers and a hammer. Either I get my ducks in a row - or the claimant (who filed the claim and got screwed by the rogue) gets screwed and I end up in a deposition as they will (rightly) file suit. I came here because the knowledge level - perhaps I'd be better off at a linesman forum - just didn't find any. The box itself is NOT damaged at all - and that is the point. I need to PROVE that it is made of a material that hail simply would not damage. I've searched through several distributors of these, but can only find STEEL (and this isn't) - and would prefer to actually call it by what it is often referred too. Will the rogue adjuster get fired - certainly hope so, but my responsibility falls to the carrier and claimant - and to refute the claim this box could somehow be damaged by a 2" round piece of ice. Seems easy - really seems common sense - but neither of those count for much. Just trying to learn and do what's right. I have sent the box numbers, the same google pic, the address it reside in to First Energy - with no affect.

So you are saying that box wasn’t damaged? So the adjuster is denying the claim on something else that was damaged? His thought was since this isn’t damaged, the hail couldn’t have damaged the other? I was wondering why the utility would care unless it stopped working.

 

[jim dungar]

What you have looks to be a 50kVA single phase pad mount transformer.

You need to ask you POCO who the manufacturer is and/or which specifications were used for its construction.
By far and away, maybe 90%, of these transformer are built using plain steel. Stainless steel is occasionally used in salt/ocean areas.

I have never heard of a general use transformer being made with a non-metallic much less a non-magnetic enclosure

 

[adjusterbrett]

Appreciate the help - I did ping the OH PUCO - what I really need to do is stumble across a First Energy group out doing and ask them with the number (three sets of numbers on the front, and a long number stenciled on the back)...

 

[Todd0x1]

A 2 inch bearing ball weighs a bit over 1lb and can be had online for around $20. Make a video of it being dropped from height onto an analog of the damaged surface and the resulting damage. Repeat on the transformer.

 

[adjusterbrett]

A 2 inch bearing ball weighs a bit over 1lb and can be had online for around $20. Make a video of it being dropped from height onto an analog of the damaged surface and the resulting damage. Repeat on the transformer.

Not mine to play with - besides a 2" ball bearing and a 2" hail stone are quite different in their energy transfer at impact. Although - for the record - I doubt it would indent it - things are pretty tough - not seen too many damaged, even in tornados. This is a FIRST for me - and I am just trying to do the right thing - you and I know those things are built like brick sh&%house - but try explaining that so someone who stares at a computer screen and simply out of touch with the mechanics of the world... BTW - if I drop a 2" bearing onto builder grade aluminum siding (019) - it would absolutely destroy it. The differential in material resilience to impact is like racing a 5 ton service truck (with boom and welder) to a Ferrari - so I too cannot believe I'm having to track this down - but the person I need to convince claims they have never seen one of those green boxes - so I'm left to this wild goose chase (LOL).

 

[winnie]

Is there a data plate visible anywhere on the enclosure? That might provide a part number or link to further information.

 

[John A]

"BUD" is Buried Underground Distribution"

The data plate more than likely is on the inside of the cover. That is where it is in the pad mount transformers.

 

[ggunn]

It seems to me that the burden of proof that the transformer was damaged by hail is on whomever is making that claim. You cannot prove that it wasn't.

 

[jim dungar]

Appreciate the help - I did ping the OH PUCO - what I really need to do is stumble across a First Energy group out doing and ask them with the number (three sets of numbers on the front, and a long number stenciled on the back)...

You need to call the POCO and ask for their engineering department not customer service. A simple electronic request will almost never get a timely response. A field crew is not likely to know the specifications for their transformer enclosures

 

[busman]

What you have looks to be a 50kVA single phase pad mount transformer.

You need to ask you POCO who the manufacturer is and/or which specifications were used for its construction.
By far and away, maybe 90%, of these transformer are built using plain steel. Stainless steel is occasionally used in salt/ocean areas.

I have never heard of a general use transformer being made with a non-metallic much less a non-magnetic enclosure

Many CRSS materials are non-magnetic.