Panel door locks...

Status
Not open for further replies.
mdshunk

mdshunk

Senior Member
Location
Right here.
Would the installation of a lock kit on a panel cabinet door constitute a disconnect that is capable of being locked in the open position? I'm puzzling on a job where I can either provide 11 local disconnects (ugly for this job), 11 breaker lockoffs, or just put a lock kit on the panel door.
 
mdshunk said:
Would the installation of a lock kit on a panel cabinet door constitute a disconnect that is capable of being locked in the open position? I'm puzzling on a job where I can either provide 11 local disconnects (ugly for this job), 11 breaker lockoffs, or just put a lock kit on the panel door.
Click to expand...

Panel door locks do not satisfy the requirements of LOTO for OSHA. The NEC requires breaker lock off kits to be "attached" to the breaker.
 
I dont know about the rest here but i have a key to most panels and usually they fit all made by that mfg..That leaves danger.Also by locking it you just defeated the safety of any other breakers acting as disconnect.Run it past your inspector but he likely not take it.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
Also by locking it you just defeated the safety of any other breakers acting as disconnect.
Click to expand...
I happen to disagree with that. I can't recall any place in the code that any disconnect be quickly accessible for an emergency. Needing to hunt the guy with the key isn't a hazard.
 
Is the disconnect locked in the off position or the panel door locked? If you want to follow this logic out, you can say that you can lock the door to the electrical room to satisfy this requirement. I think you need to install breaker locks.
 
kpepin said:
Is the disconnect locked in the off position or the panel door locked? If you want to follow this logic out, you can say that you can lock the door to the electrical room to satisfy this requirement. I think you need to install breaker locks.
Click to expand...
For air conditioner disconnects (not sidearm type), with both pullouts and breakers inside, you lock the "door" to the disconnect.
 
Do these disconnect have breakers that service other equipment? All of those type disconnects I have used only serviced one piece of equipment, so by turning them off and locking the door (usually with a padlock and not a panel lock that has a generic key that almost every electrician has) would satisfy this requirement.
 
11 lockouts at $5 has got to be faster and cheaper than installing that door lock.If its me working on equipment i would prefer the lock to be one only i have key for.Is there anychance of someone else in that building unlocking that door ?Your setting it up for danger,i just hope your not the guy getting killed.When i am dealing with door locks i put key in my pocket,red tape over key hole and place a note on door.
 
this is based on my "olefart" memory so... consider the source
10 years or so ago this was argued and the Code was revised with wording specific to the door not being allowed as the "lock"...later revisions used such wording as "individually capable of being locked"

I no longer have access to some of my Code books. Joseph McPartland in his analysis of the 1990 Code states that locking the door is acceptable, so the change in the rule must have occurred after 1990.
 
With so little information, it's difficult to see the big picture.

Based on what little we have, I'd say a panelboard with 11 breakerlocks would probably be the best way to go. As others have pointed out, locking the door isn't good enough for some standards.

But really, I don't even know what the main concern is here. OSHA? NEC?
 
jim dungar said:
Panel door locks do not satisfy the requirements of LOTO for OSHA. The NEC requires breaker lock off kits to be "attached" to the breaker.
Click to expand...

Kind of says it all doesn't it? :smile:
 
iwire said:
Kind of says it all doesn't it? :smile:
Click to expand...
Sorta. Of course a breaker lockoff kit is to be attached to the breaker. A breaker lockoff kit won't even work if it's not attached to the breaker. :grin:

My question was related to the numerous places in the code where the disconnect is "capable of being locked in the open position". (422.31, 424.19(A)(1)(2), 424.19(A)(2)(2), 424.19(B)(1), 430.102(A)(ex 1), 430.102(B)(ex), 430.113(ex 1), etc, etc) It's still not clear to me if a door lock kit satisfies this requirement or not, since there are many types of disconnects where the door is just locked to lock it in the open position. Air conditioning pullouts, specifically.
 
George Stolz said:
I always kind of figured the lock was for keeping peoples fingers out of the pullout's empty terminals when the pullout was in your pocket, personally.
Click to expand...
Is this disconnect capable of being locked in the open position? If you belive that it is, a panel door lock kit should be the same difference.
 
Disconnects that are within sight of the equipment are not required, by the NEC, to be capable of being locked open. As far as the locked cover, the cover is not the disconnecting means and the code rules require that the disconnecting means be capable of being locked open.
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
As far as the locked cover, the cover is not the disconnecting means and the code rules require that the disconnecting means be capable of being locked open.
Click to expand...

Your the man Don, always right to the point. :cool:
 
A panel cover lock does not meet the lockout requirements in the NEC. The 2008 NEC had all the lockout language changed to be consistent.
"The provision for locking or adding a lock to the disconnecting means shall be installed on or at the switch or circuit breaker used as the disconnecting means and shall remain in place with or without the lock installed."
The panel cover screws could be removed and the lock then is removed from the panel
 
tom baker said:
A panel cover lock does not meet the lockout requirements in the NEC. The 2008 NEC had all the lockout language changed to be consistent.
"The provision for locking or adding a lock to the disconnecting means shall be installed on or at the switch or circuit breaker used as the disconnecting means and shall remain in place with or without the lock installed."
The panel cover screws could be removed and the lock then is removed from the panel
Click to expand...

That can happen either way.I would prefer to see breaker locks even if the door lock was legal.If for what ever reason the cover /dead front is off i could safeguard myself by removing the wires.Covers should not be off unless guarded.
 
Locking the door appears not to be legal but is it unsafe? If I throw the breakers off inside a cabinet,confirm that they are de-energized and then lock the cabinet with a lock that only I have a key for, I feel safe. The equipment is just as locked out as if the locks were on a breaker handle.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top