Piano Bar

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

dpenbert

Member
Location
Missouri
I have a "Piano Room" to design for that has a sink, an undercounter refrigerator and an undercounter icemaker. It is shaped like a kitchen with countertop space, a peninsula w/ bar top. Should this be classified as a kitchen? I need to know if I need to apply the 2ft rule for the countertop receptacles. I'm just confused on how to label any countertop space outside of the kitchen.

Thanks,

------------
David - St. Louis
 
Re: Piano Bar

IMHO if there is no stove then it doesn`t constitute a kitchen 2002 code does not require gfci in a wet bar area 05 does .As far a s spacing i wiuld say that 2/4 does not apply aince it is not a kitchen ,but I have never seen a bar area where blenders etc are not used so there can`t be to many receps.
 
Re: Piano Bar

I don't think you need to worry about it. IMO it's not a kitchen but a wet bar. I dont't think the outlets you install even need to be on a 20 amp circuit. Just keep in mind if there is a sink, any counter outlet within 6' of the sink needs to have GFI protection
 
Re: Piano Bar

Originally posted by allenwayne:
IMHO if there is no stove then it doesn`t constitute a kitchen 2002 code does not require gfci in a wet bar area 05 does .As far a s spacing i wiuld say that 2/4 does not apply aince it is not a kitchen ,but I have never seen a bar area where blenders etc are not used so there can`t be to many receps.
Click to expand...
Here is the section of 210.8 in the following cycles:

1999
7. Wet bar sinks. Where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces and are located within 6 ft (1.83 m) of the outside edge of the wet bar sink. Receptacle outlets shall not be installed in a face-up position in the work surfaces or countertops.

2002
(7) Wet bar sinks ? where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces and are located within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the wet bar sink.

2005
(7) Laundry, utility, and wet bar sinks ? where the receptacles are installed within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the sink


I think that any receptacle with-in 6 foot is required to be GFCI protected. The spacing is not mentioned for a wet bar counter. It might be a good idea to install a couple for the drunks that will want to crush ice for their liquor or coffee so they will be wide awake drunks.
:)
 
Re: Piano Bar

This is not a gray area, it is a wet bar...unless of course they are painting the walls gray ;)

What makes this a gray area? There is no permanent cooking facilities, so no kitchen. There are no countertop spacing requirements mentioned, and 210.8(A) covers this.

Done deal, lets have a drink :cool:
 
Re: Piano Bar

Originally posted by allenwayne:
JW the 2002 cycle did not require gfci protection 05 now does but not 02(for wet bar sinks)
Click to expand...
2002 cycle
210.8 Ground-Fault Circuit-Interrupter Protection for Personnel.
FPN:See 215.9 for ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel on feeders.
(A) Dwelling Units. All 125-volt, single-phase, 15- and 20-ampere receptacles installed in the locations specified in (1) through (8) shall have ground-fault circuit-interrupter protection for personnel.
(7) Wet bar sinks ? where the receptacles are installed to serve the countertop surfaces and are located within 1.8 m (6 ft) of the outside edge of the wet bar sink.
Click to expand...
My 2002 book did. Where did you get yours from?
:)
 
Re: Piano Bar

Mike, I think all the 2002 books are the same as yours. ;)

Roger
 
Re: Piano Bar

I stand corrected and to think i have won this argument before with ahj .My humble appoligies ,guess i should read before posting :eek:
 
Re: Piano Bar

I doubt they will paint their walls gray :)
210.52(C)(3) requires kitchen and dining room peninsulas to be installed at each counter space. According to the responses, this is not required for the piano bar, is there anywhere else in the code that requires me to have a receptacle for the peninsula?
Thanks :cool:

[ December 16, 2005, 10:20 AM: Message edited by: dpenbert ]
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top