Piece work?

[JJWalecka]

Does anyone pay by piece work?
I have worked with metal framers and sheet rocker who get paid in this fashion.

Does anyone have experience in this method of payment in regard to roughing out? Thank you for your time.

JJ

 

[peter d]

Piece work can work great for things that can be installed quickly in a repetitive fashion, like steel studs and sheet rock for instance.

However, it does not work so well for electrical work. Roughing and trimming out tract houses is about the only thing that would work well with a piece system IMO.

 

[Pullnwire]

I have been paid piecework for ballast retrofits, and fixture change outs. On the other hand, I dont pay peicework for trim or anything else, people try and go too fast, and the the callbacks start.

 

[wbalsam1]

Back in the 1970's I used to charge $15.00 per lighting and/or receptacle outlet and $17.50 per switched receptacle and/or lighting outlets. Then the range, water heater, furnace, dryer, etc, were a flat $50.00. This was rough only and I supplied all romex, staples, boxes and labor. Made a lot of money doing that. :smile: (wish I had some of it now.)

 

[480sparky]

Piece work works well for drywall. Drywall is pretty much drywall. Sheetorockers don't have 15a drywall, 20a drywall, 30a drywall, 50a drywall, drywall in trenches, drywall on light poles. drywall in CMU walls, drywall on RTUs, Service Entrance drywall.......

 

[SEO]

Good analogy 480sparky.:smile:

 

[khixxx]

When I was with my old company we put in all the services, and outdoor light poles for a strip mall but someone else wired them. Sorry I don't know if the company made money or what the deal was.

 

[walkerj]

I remember someone posting about a crew geting paid by the unit to trim an apartment complex. Final comes and goes and when the power is turned on, nothing works. Turns out they didn't make up any of the devices. Ouch.

While my experience with this method was not this extreme, it seems most will rush and cut corners just to make more in less time.

 

[billdozier]

I moved to orlando with intentions of making tons of money on the piece. Ha was I in for a rude awakening. The trim was a joke you came behind guys who halfassed on the rough had to fix there mistakes and deal with nitpicky gcs. On the roughs I was used to stick frame building and could fly. Down there it was more cinderblock and metal studs. So it was a whole nother game. a month later I was getting paid by the hour working for another contractor. So to sum it up avoid piece work at all costs when it comes to electrical workhttp://forums.mikeholt.com/images/smilies/mad.gif

 

[walkerj]

When I was with my old company we put in all the services, and outdoor light poles for a strip mall but someone else wired them. Sorry I don't know if the company made money or what the deal was.

Money can be made IF the crews are worth their weight in 15a drywall.
But if the power is turned on and a bunch of stuff is screwed up and the crew is back in Juarez for the weekend, money is lost in paying your A-class guys to fix their screw-ups on OT.
That was my experience numerous times on a couple apartment jobs.
Owner kept giving them chance after chance.

 

[mdshunk]

I'm not sure who wins in these electrician piece work arrangements. Employers see it as a clever way to stick it to the workmen and not pay them as much for X amount of work as they would if the person was hourly. Employees see it as a clever way to stick it to the boss, doing as much work as they can that appears to function so they can get paid before anyone finds out it was all crap work. I find that hourly plus certain measurable performance bonuses to be a better system.

 

[George Stolz]

Does anyone have experience in this method of payment in regard to roughing out?

Yes. I quit that company and started working for a reputable EC. Any questions?

 

[tkb]

When I had my own business I took lighting jobs that my company got paid by the piece, but I paid my guys by the hour.
We just had to be very efficient to make the numbers work.

 

[khixxx]

Owner kept giving them chance after chance.

With everyone not know what company had to do what even sometimes using another companies material. I don't know if the company made money, But like you say they keep doing it. So did they make money? I will never ever know. I guess thats why I use the shovel and the owner does well what ever he does. If that makes sense.

 

[JJWalecka]

Thanks for your time and feedback

JJ

 

[emahler]

Piece work can work great for things that can be installed quickly in a repetitive fashion, like steel studs and sheet rock for instance.

However, it does not work so well for electrical work. Roughing and trimming out tract houses is about the only thing that would work well with a piece system IMO.

tell that to every electrical contractor who gives fixed priced for any electrical work other than tract houses...i'm sure they would be interested in knowing that it's not good to do that....

like anything else in this world, if done properly, it's a win-win for the employer and employee....if done wrong it's a lose-lose....if done really wrong, it's a win-lose...

but like i said, every single electrical contractor who gives a fixed price for a project works on piecework...why can't it work for employees?

 

[Aledrell]

tell that to every electrical contractor who gives fixed priced for any electrical work other than tract houses...i'm sure they would be interested in knowing that it's not good to do that....

like anything else in this world, if done properly, it's a win-win for the employer and employee....if done wrong it's a lose-lose....if done really wrong, it's a win-lose...

but like i said, every single electrical contractor who gives a fixed price for a project works on piecework...why can't it work for employees?

There is a company called xxxxxx here that had wiring track down to science expense wise but they were terrible I don't even want to call them electricians. From my understanding here is how they operate. You and 2 of your buddies decide on percentages for the crew of three if your all same level etc it be 33-33-33 but this never the case. Then you go do to company yard and look at prints availbe for the tracks and each print or house pays different amount for rough. When you take one of the prints or assignments available you get your truck load with palletized romex panel etc needed for the job calculated with minimum waste of course. You rope the house then get paid on 1099 your percentage. I have been told good piece crews do 3000 sq ft a day but work 10-12 hours. After the rough the company send through a "hot checker" who is hourly the only one with the slightest electrical knowledge and ability to speak english. He checks out the rough for errors and checks for shorts, etc. At trim it's the same but these guys are going so fast and don't care they don't ground any of the switches. Work like this puts our tradecraft to same.

 

[Fulthrotl]

but like i said, every single electrical contractor who gives a fixed price for a project works on piecework...why can't it work for employees?

legally? because it makes them subcontractors.
and violates a passle of labor laws, unless part
of a collective bargaining agreement....

W-2 = employee
1099 = subcontractor

so, the simple solution is to become affiliated
with a collective bargaining organization,
and then try to include piecework in the working
agreement.... simple, yes?

 

[emahler]

legally? because it makes them subcontractors.
and violates a passle of labor laws, unless part
of a collective bargaining agreement....

W-2 = employee
1099 = subcontractor

so, the simple solution is to become affiliated
with a collective bargaining organization,
and then try to include piecework in the working
agreement.... simple, yes?

wow...completely incorrect...please do a search here before you type

 

[macmikeman]

There is a company called xxxxxx here that had wiring track down to science expense wise but they were terrible I don't even want to call them electricians. From my understanding here is how they operate. You and 2 of your buddies decide on percentages for the crew of three if your all same level etc it be 33-33-33 but this never the case. Then you go do to company yard and look at prints availbe for the tracks and each print or house pays different amount for rough. When you take one of the prints or assignments available you get your truck load with palletized romex panel etc needed for the job calculated with minimum waste of course. You rope the house then get paid on 1099 your percentage. I have been told good piece crews do 3000 sq ft a day but work 10-12 hours. After the rough the company send through a "hot checker" who is hourly the only one with the slightest electrical knowledge and ability to speak english. He checks out the rough for errors and checks for shorts, etc. At trim it's the same but these guys are going so fast and don't care they don't ground any of the switches. Work like this puts our tradecraft to same.

Gee Aledrell, I sure hope you live somewhere besides the Los Angeles area, like maybe Arizona, or I am about to suffer a real hero worship letdown from your post.