Plastic Water Main

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B4T

B4T

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Long Island, N.Y.
I am doing a 600 amp single phase service with(6) 200 amp. panels. Each meter has an outside circuit breaker. Water main is plastic and I want to use building steel as grounding path. I ran a #4 from each 200 amp. panel to building steel. What size wire do I need from meter bank to building steel and what size to stub of copper water main that comes through the slab.
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
I am doing a 600 amp single phase service with(6) 200 amp. panels. Each meter has an outside circuit breaker. Water main is plastic and I want to use building steel as grounding path. I ran a #4 from each 200 amp. panel to building steel. What size wire do I need from meter bank to building steel and what size to stub of copper water main that comes through the slab.
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read article 250.66 its right there
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
I am doing a 600 amp single phase service with(6) 200 amp. panels. Each meter has an outside circuit breaker.
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So I am assuming you mean that there is not one service disconnect enclosure, you are using the six panelboard Main Breakers as the service disconnects, and have Grounding Electrode Conductors (GECs) running from each of these to building steel.

I want to use building steel as grounding path.
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See 250.52(A)(2)

What size wire do I need from meter bank to building steel...
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Provided my assumptions above are true, why do you need a GEC to the meter bank? Your GES is starting at the disconnects, not at the meters.

...and what size to stub of copper water main that comes through the slab.
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If it is not an electrode per 250.52(A)(1), then is it a metal water piping system inside requiring bonding per 250.104(A)?
 
I have a 600 amp disconnect swch at meter bank.. I have parallell 350 mcm cu. for feeders to Disc switch.. it is GEC to water main I am confused about. All water piping is PEX inside of building.. thanks for your help
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
what size wire do I need from meter bank to building steel and what size to stub of copper water main that comes through the slab.
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1/0 cu if you have ten feet or more of metal pipe in the earth.
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
I have a 600 amp disconnect swch at meter bank.. I have parallell 350 mcm cu. for feeders to Disc switch.. it is GEC to water main I am confused about.
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No, I think you're confused about the Grounding Electrode System (GES) starting point. 250.24(A)(1) requires it to be at the service disconnect. The bonding conductors running from the subpanels are not required. You need a 2/0 CU or 4/0 AL GEC from the service disconnect to the GES.

The #4's aren't doing that for you.

All water piping is PEX inside of building.. thanks for your help
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It's physically implausible to bond plastic, so you're safe there. :)
 
OK... I have direct burial from meter bank to 200 amp panels.. (3) 3/0 conductors. I was told each 200 amp panel is considered a sup-panel because of 600 amp main and needs a GEC at each panel.. why I ran #4 to building steel
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
OK... I have direct burial from meter bank to 200 amp panels.. (3) 3/0 conductors. I was told each 200 amp panel is considered a sup-panel because of 600 amp main and needs a GEC at each panel.. why I ran #4 to building steel
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So the main disconnect and meters are at a remote location on a separate structure located away from the 6-200 amp panels?
 
no... building is 300ft long with (6) units. A trench was dug in back of building for phone, CATV, and electric. I used direct burial instead of piping to save on labor and materials
 
Blacktruck....

You're not giving a clear description of your installation....to me anyway....so it's hard to give any advice.

Start from the front again.:smile:

steve
 
I think I can see the picture - I stick by my original statement, unless you want to examine how (if there happen to be firewalls) we could see the six units as being separate structures, which would start involving 250.32.
 
Would'nt 250.24(B) exception # 1 come into play here and require the GEC be brought to the service disconnect enclosure ( where the bonding jumper is made).

Rick
 
RUWired said:
Would'nt 250.24(B) exception # 1 come into play here and require the GEC be brought to the service disconnect enclosure ( where the bonding jumper is made).

Rick
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I don't think exception 1 comes into play, I think the main rule does though. He stated there is only one service disconnect. :)
 
George Stolz said:
I don't think exception 1 comes into play, I think the main rule does though. He stated there is only one service disconnect. :)
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Your right, i was thinking "if" it was a main lug, but got side tracked when the door bell rang, the dog barked and the cell phone went off.
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Rick
 
complete description of job

complete description of job

Job: 600 amp single phase service with (6) 200 amp panels. Meter bank has (6) 200 amp. breakers. 600 amp. disconnect switch controls meter bank. I ran 3 sets of 350 mcm from transformer to disc. switch. I ran (3) 3/0 feeders direct burial to each 200 amp panel. Building has PEX water piping.. copper riser where RPG valve comes through slab. I will have a 1/0 cu.GEC from RPG pipe to building steel and 2/0 cu.GEC from building steel to 600 amp. disc switch. I also ran #4 from building steel to each 200 amp panel for GEC. Do I need the #4 Cu GEC?? I want to thank all of you who have taken the time to read my post and given me advise
 
BLACK4TRUCK said:
Job: 600 amp single phase service with (6) 200 amp panels. Meter bank has (6) 200 amp. breakers. 600 amp. disconnect switch controls meter bank. I ran 3 sets of 350 mcm from transformer to disc. switch. I ran (3) 3/0 feeders direct burial to each 200 amp panel. Building has PEX water piping.. copper riser where RPG valve comes through slab. I will have a 1/0 cu.GEC from RPG pipe to building steel and 2/0 cu.GEC from building steel to 600 amp. disc switch. I also ran #4 from building steel to each 200 amp panel for GEC. Do I need the #4 Cu GEC?? I want to thank all of you who have taken the time to read my post and given me advise
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I would think that the 600amp disco would be considered the service disconnect and require a GEC sized per T250.66, note #1.
 
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