Play the "How"s my number?" game

[Mr.Sparkle]

ASS U ME Thats what happens.

hehehe....true true, I will be meeting with the builder to go over what I drew on the plans before giving my price.

 

[Sparky555]

I came up with $13,500.00, this number feels high to me....is that because it is?

IMO this is the biggest profit-reducer for an EC. We work up the number, get a twinge that it feels high & reduce the number. It's a LOT more fun to stick with the number & have a good profit.

 

[celtic]

40 14awg Recept
16 20awg Recept

You talk funny round eye.....so are these all 15A circuits?

I came up with $13,500.00, this number feels high to me....is that because it is? :grin: Is that because I worked for a sq/ft. price estimating lowballer for a few years prior to getting my seal?:grin: I have no shame, I told you I was green.

I'll post a number later on [like Saturday night...LOL] ....it's late and I want to sleep ~ have another inspection tom'row in the PM...and what didn't get done today gotta done in the AM

 

[Mr.Sparkle]

I looked at how I typed that and thought "Who is gonna bust my chops on that one?" :grin: Just to clarify, I was referring to the white plug without the little extra slash wired with that yellow stuff and stuck in one of those blue boxes. :grin:

 

[celtic]

I looked at how I typed that and thought "Who is gonna bust my chops on that one?" :grin:

Leave it to the Jersey guys :grin:


********
Tell me a little more about the kitchen...any additional circuits other than the mandatory?
ie, refrig, DW, MW, etc

How many bathrooms? 3?

Garage? GDO?

 

[Mr.Sparkle]

Basic Kitchen (dish, micro, fridge HR) no garage, 3 bath. only thing really above your basic electric is 5 ceiling fans 2 pendants over island, and four 6" cans. Builder may ask for a few more recessed around, I know I would want them in the kitchen....., we are going over the plans tomorrow. 1 Zone HVAC full basement, I believe all other appliances are gas, he did not mention anything else to me, I will double check tomorrow. I like working for this builder, all the work I have done for him thus-far has been a godsend, everything has gone smooth, never been questioned by him or his customers, but this is the first full house I am giving him a price on so I want to be as on point as possible. He seems to have plenty of work (he is not pulling the I have more work for you give me a good price card, this is my own observation) Thanks guys!

 

[celtic]

I'm at $19,516.66 with man-hours of 150; NOT including the service....add another $2k +/- .

Mr.Sparkle...answer a couple more questions if you would, please:
- How much do charge for a 15A recept.?
- How much for a 20A GFCI [interior]?

Do these figures include:
- homerun ?
- CB?

 

[Mr.Sparkle]

I just got home from my meeting with the builder to go over my drawing. Everything was fine, only clarifications are that there will be 2 Zones HVAC and he wants 8 more cans. MO MONEY MO MONEY MO MONEY.....

15A recept. $60
20 Interior GFI $75

My $13,500.00 number was including $2k for 200A MB service (found out today that poco will take care of 200ft. underground up to house, I am responsible for meter pan/ MB panel directly below in basement).

I figured $1200.00 for HR's after looking at the print and paths.

 

[celtic]

15A recept. $60
20 Interior GFI $75

How did you arrive at that price?

Here is an example of how I arrived at my figure for a 15A recept. [it's a little dated as the price is higher today than it was in 2007]:

 

[tonyou812]

How did you arrive at that price?

Here is an example of how I arrived at my figure for a 15A recept. [it's a little dated as the price is higher today than it was in 2007]:

WOW your spread sheet gave me a Pavlov"S response! my mouth started watering. not just cause of your price, but the organization of it all. I love it. I put a lot of work into my prices too but with a little "kentuky windaging"

 

[iwire]

How did you arrive at that price?

Here is an example of how I arrived at my figure for a 15A recept. [it's a little dated as the price is higher today than it was in 2007]:

Celtic, just wondering why there is a labor unit for rough and finish when that seems to be already coved item by item. Or is that for inspections? Not criticizing just wondering. :smile:

 

[Mr.Sparkle]

Honestly, I am not even gonna act like I broke it down like that. I found examples like that (yours and others) from searching here and at forums abroad, narrowed them down regionally, used the figures as a rough guide (rounding up if the post was dated) and then compared them to what I know the last EC I worked for charged and what I feel I should be charging based on what I think my operating costs are, I say think because I am new to this side of the game. Lets put it this way, in the last 2 months I have read a couple Ellen Rohr books and the E Myth contractor book, so how much time do you think I spent reading these forums?:grin: :grin: I also have a few other business related books I have not gotten into yet, one step at a time for me on that side of the fence. As much as I would like to "break it down" at the moment I have little time to do so, word is getting around that I got my seal and quite a few contractors I have good relationships with from my former employer are looking for me, with all this doom and gloom my gut instinct is not to let a single inquiry slide by the wayside no matter how green I am. I just am paranoid about starting off on the wrong foot in a business sense. As the world turns I will get more time to put into a serious dissection of what I want out of my business but for now I will navigate the maze with as much confidence as I possibly can.

 

[celtic]

WOW your spread sheet gave me a Pavlov"S response! my mouth started watering. not just cause of your price, but the organization of it all. I love it. I put a lot of work into my prices too but with a little "kentuky windaging"

Here is another page from the spreadsheet:

It's all about organization.....and finding current pricing info that can EASILY be added :wink:

 

[celtic]

Celtic, just wondering why there is a labor unit for rough and finish when that seems to be already coved item by item. Or is that for inspections? Not criticizing just wondering. :smile:

Good question iwire!

It's not inspection purposes at all, but rather for payment :smile:

If you look at lines 115/116 you can see just how much/how long the rough/finish will take/cost. In general, the rough comes in at about 67.8% of the total job. By the time I call for a rough inspection, I want to have at least 75% of the job cost in pocket [Cells H123 & I123]

This shot is of Mr.Sparkle's job. Cell D115 tells me the rough portion of the job will take appx. 82.3 manhours, and the finish[Cell J115] will take appx. 66.5 manhours.
These figures allow for normal material handling - drive time, purchasing, etc.
The bulk of the material cost is on the rough [E115] rather than the finish [K115]

*****************************

New in v2.1 are cells A/B119 - A/B131.
Everyone always asks: How much per sq. ft.? ....and the answer is typically something along the lines of "Do you buy wire by the sq.ft.?" ...and then a battle ensues
So I added it. Between my own database and these "Just for fun bid" type threads, I am getting a very good feel for the perpetual "per sq. ft." question....as a ball park figure - not something I would sign my company name to and risk coming up short!

 

[celtic]

Honestly, I am not even gonna act like I broke it down like that. I found examples like that (yours and others) from searching here and at forums abroad, narrowed them down regionally, used the figures as a rough guide (rounding up if the post was dated) and then compared them to what I know the last EC I worked for charged and what I feel I should be charging based on what I think my operating costs are, I say think because I am new to this side of the game. Lets put it this way, in the last 2 months I have read a couple Ellen Rohr books and the E Myth contractor book, so how much time do you think I spent reading these forums?:grin: :grin: I also have a few other business related books I have not gotten into yet, one step at a time for me on that side of the fence. As much as I would like to "break it down" at the moment I have little time to do so, word is getting around that I got my seal and quite a few contractors I have good relationships with from my former employer are looking for me, with all this doom and gloom my gut instinct is not to let a single inquiry slide by the wayside no matter how green I am. I just am paranoid about starting off on the wrong foot in a business sense. As the world turns I will get more time to put into a serious dissection of what I want out of my business but for now I will navigate the maze with as much confidence as I possibly can.

The sheets I created did NOT happen over night. You are right about the time factor as it took me months to create it...and it is still evolving.

Your on the right track with those authors

...I'd like to add another thing for you to read:
Plumbing and Mechanical magazine

I know it's a plumbing trade magazine, however they talk every month about the BUSINESS aspect of the trade [it doesn't really matter what trade, as -IMHO - it applies to all the mechanical trades]
In it you will find some very good authors...like this one:
The Best-Kept Secret
Ellen Rohr

Did I mention it's FREE

PM Mag touches on areas not covered very well by the likes of EC&M and EC Mag. I haven't figured out why some of the Columnist at PM Mag haven't sold their words to EC Mag[SIZE=-1] :-?
[/SIZE]

 

[Mr.Sparkle]

Thanks for all the help and insight, the information found here is invaluable. I'll check all that stuff out. Btw, just noticed something in your sheet, AFCI? I was under the impression we are still ok with 2005? I am pretty sure, I was told this not too long ago from a ceu teacher/inspector, am I wrong?

 

[celtic]

Btw, just noticed something in your sheet, AFCI? I was under the impression we are still ok with 2005? I am pretty sure, I was told this not too long ago from a ceu teacher/inspector, am I wrong?

Under the '05 in NJ, AFCI protection was "optional" ...so why not add it into the mix? Someone might actually want it
The answer is always NO until you ask :wink:

I anticipated that under the '08, AFCI would become mandatory...and it looks like it's going to happen.

 

[emahler]

Under the '05 in NJ, AFCI protection was "optional" ...so why not add it into the mix? Someone might actually want it
The answer is always NO until you ask :wink:

I anticipated that under the '08, AFCI would become mandatory...and it looks like it's going to happen.

i heard around jan of 09....should be seeing a letter from susan borek in the next few weeks....