First thanks for the responses from my other pool questions.I wired a pool no niche 120 volt luminare. 680.23(B)(2)(b)requires a #8 insulated copper equipment grounding conductor in the 3/4 pvc that feeds my luminaire which is fed with cord also in same pvc. In my pool j box I have #12 insulated ground from panel #12 ins gnd to sw 4 luminaire #14 ins gnd in cord to luminaire # 8 ins gnd to luminaire shell.With 1 #8 in pool box conected to #12 egc how is the #8 in box bringing pool luminaire to same potential as #8 pool bond conected to all metal at pool?Thanks for any help as I cant sleep, I dont think the ahj understands this as much as I.
Please help me understand pool bonding
- Thread starter jjackson
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
If I'm understanding this correctly you pulled the #8 AWG solid copper bonding conductor into the conduit feeding the no-niche fixture? How hard was that in a 3/4 conduit?
680.26(B) lists all of the parts that are required to be bonded together. Typically the equipment grounding conductor for the light is run with the supply circuit from the service or feeder panelboard. The #8 AWG solid copper bonding conductor is run from the all metal forming shells or mounting bracket of a no-niche fixture to the other metallic parts of the pool. Typically this connection is on the outside of the forming shell or bracket and installed prior to the pouring of the pool.
Look at 680.26(B)(1) through(5).
[ May 07, 2005, 09:35 AM: Message edited by: infinity ]
If I'm understanding this correctly you pulled the #8 AWG solid copper bonding conductor into the conduit feeding the no-niche fixture? How hard was that in a 3/4 conduit?
680.26(B) lists all of the parts that are required to be bonded together. Typically the equipment grounding conductor for the light is run with the supply circuit from the service or feeder panelboard. The #8 AWG solid copper bonding conductor is run from the all metal forming shells or mounting bracket of a no-niche fixture to the other metallic parts of the pool. Typically this connection is on the outside of the forming shell or bracket and installed prior to the pouring of the pool.
Look at 680.26(B)(1) through(5).
[ May 07, 2005, 09:35 AM: Message edited by: infinity ]
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
Thanks for your response I pulled a #8 stranded insulated with the cord as per 680.23(B)(2)(b)The metal mounting bracket is 18 inches below the water and I used the aproved potting compound to cover lug. I understand the #8 bond required for all metal parts this light did have a lug on the outside also that I connected to the #8 solid bond . I just dont understand the #8 inside connected to #12 equipment ground conductor again per 680.23(B)(2)(b)
p.s. the #8 and cord pulled through fine.
Thanks for your response I pulled a #8 stranded insulated with the cord as per 680.23(B)(2)(b)The metal mounting bracket is 18 inches below the water and I used the aproved potting compound to cover lug. I understand the #8 bond required for all metal parts this light did have a lug on the outside also that I connected to the #8 solid bond . I just dont understand the #8 inside connected to #12 equipment ground conductor again per 680.23(B)(2)(b)
p.s. the #8 and cord pulled through fine.
- Location
- Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
- Occupation
- Service Manager
- Location
- New Jersey
- Occupation
- Journeyman Electrician
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
JJ,
Your original question mentioned a no-niche fixture , isn't this different from 680.23(B)(2) which pertains to Wet-niche forming shells?
JJ,
Your original question mentioned a no-niche fixture , isn't this different from 680.23(B)(2) which pertains to Wet-niche forming shells?
jwelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- North Carolina
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
(D) No-Niche Luminaires (Fixtures) A no-niche luminaire (fixture) shall meet the construction requirements of 680.23(B)(3) and be installed in accordance with the requirements of 680.23(B). Where connection to a forming shell is specified, the connection shall be to the mounting bracket.
- Location
- Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
- Occupation
- Service Manager
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
Another "read-the-original-post-closely" guy. What is this place coming to?
Another "read-the-original-post-closely" guy. What is this place coming to?
- Location
- Massachusetts
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
Yeah why is he answering the question that was asked?Originally posted by georgestolz:
Another "read-the-original-post-closely" guy. What is this place coming to?
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
Pools,Pools.Pools they get more confusing as time goes on
Pools,Pools.Pools they get more confusing as time goes on
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
The #8 solid copper wire also has to run from the equipotential grid of the pool walls to the frame of the pool pump. This is a completely different equipment ground from the one for the pool light.
120 volt underwater lights are obsolete DINOSAURS. All of the swimming pool contractors around here use fiber optic pool lights which get rid of a lot of installation, maintenance, and safetyn issues. There is one fiber optic light on the market that uses a long life 100 watt metal halide lamp in the light source box that sits in the pump room or other convenient location.
The purpose of the #8 solid copper wire, rebar bonding, and pump bonding is to create a shield against electricity flowing through the soil from say broken down underground wiring. You have to have the #8 solid copper wire and equipotential grid in the pool walls and floor even if there is no underwater light. When electricity flows through the soil from a broken underground line or somebody's open neutral, concrete slabs and drain pipes become partially energized creating nasty tingle voltages. This is how you can get shocked by correctly grounded appliances and plumbing. I have seen this situation involving insulation and conduit breakdown in an old electrical line going to a detached garage and 1 of the symptoms was $400 per month electric bills for a house that had gas heat and a gas stove and a gas water heater.
The #8 solid copper wire also has to run from the equipotential grid of the pool walls to the frame of the pool pump. This is a completely different equipment ground from the one for the pool light.
120 volt underwater lights are obsolete DINOSAURS. All of the swimming pool contractors around here use fiber optic pool lights which get rid of a lot of installation, maintenance, and safetyn issues. There is one fiber optic light on the market that uses a long life 100 watt metal halide lamp in the light source box that sits in the pump room or other convenient location.
The purpose of the #8 solid copper wire, rebar bonding, and pump bonding is to create a shield against electricity flowing through the soil from say broken down underground wiring. You have to have the #8 solid copper wire and equipotential grid in the pool walls and floor even if there is no underwater light. When electricity flows through the soil from a broken underground line or somebody's open neutral, concrete slabs and drain pipes become partially energized creating nasty tingle voltages. This is how you can get shocked by correctly grounded appliances and plumbing. I have seen this situation involving insulation and conduit breakdown in an old electrical line going to a detached garage and 1 of the symptoms was $400 per month electric bills for a house that had gas heat and a gas stove and a gas water heater.
shortcircuit2
Senior Member
- Location
- South of Bawstin
Re: Please help me understand pool bonding
jjackson...there must be a connection between the lug inside the luminaire where the #8 stranded bonding wire is terminated and the solid bonding connection to the frame of this no niche fixture...right?
shortcircuit2
jjackson...there must be a connection between the lug inside the luminaire where the #8 stranded bonding wire is terminated and the solid bonding connection to the frame of this no niche fixture...right?
shortcircuit2
- Status