POCO Vs. Generator Fire

Status
Not open for further replies.
N

Npstewart

Senior Member
I just got an interesting call for a project that we declined to get involved with. Essentially the GC for a large franchise sent an email to the power company informing them not to connect power to a building because they had a generator connected. Apparently someone didn't get the message so the POCO went out there and connected the power while the generator was powering the building. Im not exactly sure of the particulars but basically something caught on fire and covered the interior of the store with black soot. The GC / EC & Owner wants the POCO to cover the damages.

The GC & EC are saying this is the POCO companys fault and the POCO is saying its the EC/GC. Who do you think is right in this situation?

FYI, this is new construction so the property never had power.
 
I’m confused...
Why would anyone have to tell a power company NOT to connect the power?
Someone had to ask for it to be turned on. They just don’t turn on power to buildings unless someone is assuming responsibility for the usage.
 
Thats an usual request not to connect power. the way it works here is once your service is approved, and the green approved label is on the meter, then the owner contacts the POCO. All the service connections I have ever done or been involved with the electrician is always on site when POCO is connecting power
 
I'm guessing building was complete and POCO was dragging feet getting power to building.
Generator was being used so business could open.
Business sent email saying don't connect power until they can coordinate temporary shut down of business and disconnect generator.

Very common in my area to feed homes or businesses off temp power pole or businesses off generators waiting for permanent power.
POCO will refuse to connect if they show up and business is being supplied by some form of temp power. They require it to be disconnect first.

It seems in this case POCO crew was not very bright.

Also in my area they generally don't close customer breakers. They leave that up to customer, GC or EC. POCO does not want liability for property damage or injury since they have no idea what is after the service disconnect.
 
All excellent input. This was just a brief phone call for me and I wish I knew more (not). In my opinion, theres definitely more to this story and it sounds like someone left a generator un-attended or started it after connection.

Not to mention, whomever was connecting power for the POCO could have gotten killed if a generator was directly connected.
 
There's got to be more to the story-
who knows what actually burned?
whether the temp generator was powering the whole place or just part of it?
(how the generator was connected?)
how far away was the gen from the building? (close enough to notice?)

I'm betting that the poco crew didn't notice a generator and didn't check the terminals/riser to see if it was already energized, then lit them up.
--or--
The gen was properly wired into a sub-panel and a completely unrelated fault occurred when another part of the building went live.
(emphasizing that those are complete WAGs)
 
ptonsparky said:
There is more to the story somewhere. I've never had a POCO turn on the power to a new service unless we were there. Too many questions left unanswered, let alone asked.
Click to expand...
Absolutely. In fact, "turn on power" is not something a utility does at all. They CONNECT your meter to their grid, but "turning on power" is the USER responsibility.

The only thing I can imagine is that maybe the user had the Service Entrance OCPD closed even though they were running on a generator, and/or they connected the generator feed to the line side of the SUSE breaker WITHOUT first disconnecting the utility feed conductors(???). So when the utility connected the elbows on the transformer primary, it energized the SUSE device and generator out of synch. That would have been user stupidity. Fire / soot would not be the only result, it could have caused major damage to the utility transformer too. There is DEFINIETLY more to this story.
 
Def more. Assuming what Jref mentioned above, when utility did make that connection, I have to imagine its was not without an event. Seems like there had to be a breaker or switch involved otherwise it would be apparent when connecting?? Breakers and switchs can close instantly, connections take time and and will arc, spark, explode if connecting two different energized systems? Just my thinking.
 
Several things had to have happen at a minimum, contractor connected the generator on the line side of the main, which would have energized the utility transformer, when the lineman closed the jacks, or put the elbows in (most likely Jack’s though) surge probably took out the customer side equipment, and possibly the generator. As others have said, I have never seen the utility company close a customers breaker. So it will probably be on the contractor that incorrectly tied the temp generator on the utility side of the main, or left the main on/ no lock/tag, and main was turned on by others. ( yeah, one of my guys done that on storm duty, they connected correctly to the gear, but did not lock and tag out the main. Utility came back on, store manager went out and flipped the main back on, frying the generator and all of the stores POS systems)
 
Last edited:
hillbilly1 said:
Several things had to have happen at a minimum, contractor connected the generator on the line side of the main, which would have energized the utility transformer, when the lineman closed the jacks, or put the elbows in (most likely Jack’s though) surge probably took out the customer side equipment, and possibly the generator. As others have said, I have never seen the utility company close a customers breaker. So it will probably be on the contractor that incorrectly tied the temp generator on the utility side of the main, or left the main on/ no lock/tag, and main was turned on by others. ( yeah, one of my guys done that on storm duty, they connected correctly to the gear, but did not lock and tag out the main. Utility came back on, store manager went out and flipped the main back on, frying the generator and all of the stores POS systems)
Click to expand...
Witnessed that a couple of times in my career..
We generally win because our fault currents are way more than a generator..😉
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top