"Point on the Wiring System"

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shortcircuit2

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Where is the "point" current is taken to supply utilization equipment equipped with a 6-ft attachment cord attached to a 6-ft appliance cord connected to a receptacle outlet?
1. The receptacle outlet where the appliance cord's attachment plug is plugged in?
2. The utilization equipment's 6-ft attachment cord plugged into the appliance cord female end?
3. Inside the utilization equipment where the 6-ft attachment cord terminates?
4. Your interpretation is?

Where is the "point" current is taken to supply an outdoor AC Condenser (utilization equipment)?
1. The load-side connection to the disconnect at the outdoor AC Condenser?
2. The connection to the branch circuit overcurrent device in the distribution panel?
3. Inside the condenser where the branch circuit wiring terminates?
4. Your Interpretation is?
 
Outlet.
A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment. (CMP-1)
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It is the point on the wiring system, so for a receptacle it is the contacts in the receptacle that the plug blades connect with. The cord is not part of the wiring system. It is part of the appliance.

For hard wired equipment, it is the load end of the branch circuit conductors, and that is at the termination in the equipment where the branch circuit conductors connect to the internal wiring of the equipment.
 
shortcircuit2 said:
Where is the "point" current is taken to supply utilization equipment equipped with a 6-ft attachment cord attached to a 6-ft appliance cord connected to a receptacle outlet?
1. The receptacle outlet where the appliance cord's attachment plug is plugged in?
2. The utilization equipment's 6-ft attachment cord plugged into the appliance cord female end?
3. Inside the utilization equipment where the 6-ft attachment cord terminates?
4. Your interpretation is?
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If I am reading you correctly it doesn't make any difference. The current is the same at all those points as long as there are no branches in the circuit.
 
The specific point is relevant to one of the definitions in the NEC. The "point at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment," I think maybe it's the definition of "outlet." And so, a specific interpretation of exactly which point is meant is necessary to understand exactly what the definition means.
 
Mr. Serious said:
The specific point is relevant to one of the definitions in the NEC. The "point at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment," I think maybe it's the definition of "outlet." And so, a specific interpretation of exactly which point is meant is necessary to understand exactly what the definition means.
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That works for cord and plug equipment but hard wired equipment is taken at the lugs. And North American style motors at the pigtails.

I thought you were going to get caught up in the point to point method of short circuit calculations.
 
paulengr said:
That works for cord and plug equipment but hard wired equipment is taken at the lugs. And North American style motors at the pigtails.

I thought you were going to get caught up in the point to point method of short circuit calculations.
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No, I was just trying to emphasize that I think the first reply was correct, rather than the one immediately above mine which said it doesn't matter. For many purposes, it really doesn't matter, but for the purpose of the definition, it should be just one well-defined point.
 
The distinction is, I think, neatly summed up in the recognition that an extension cord is not allowed to serve as part of the permanent wiring system, so it does not affect the location of the outlet point.
In the case of hard wired equipment, the field installed Chapter 3 wiring becomes part of the building wiring system.
This does leave an edge case where the equipment is supplied with flexible cord which is intended to be hard attached to building wiring in a junction box. If that is in fact code compliant, I would say that the outlet is where the flexible cord is wired in.
 
Permanent Wiring System, Temporary Wiring System, Building Wiring System, Premises Wiring System, Wiring System

Outlet.
A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment. (CMP-1)

Should "premises wiring system" be in the Outlet definition?

Wiring System is vague and has no NEC definition...

I am doing this exercise because the "point" is not as clear to many electricians as you may think. I must say it is widely misunderstood and a term that I have struggled with myself.
 
shortcircuit2 said:
Permanent Wiring System, Temporary Wiring System, Building Wiring System, Premises Wiring System, Wiring System

Outlet.
A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment. (CMP-1)

Should "premises wiring system" be in the Outlet definition?

Wiring System is vague and has no NEC definition...

I am doing this exercise because the "point" is not as clear to many electricians as you may think. I must say it is widely misunderstood and a term that I have struggled with myself.
Click to expand...
I don't see an issue with understanding from people who actually read all of the code sections, but if you seen an issue, there is plenty of time for you to submit a Public Input to make a change in the 2026 code. Those PIs have to be submitted by the 7th or 8th of September, 2023. The code will not be open for submission of PIs for the 2026 code until the 2023 code is published. That should be in August or September of 2022.
 
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