Pool Bonding...

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chevyx92

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VA BCH, VA
I thought I saw one time on here a diagram or an article that Mike Holt put out on the proper way to bond pools and pool equipment. Anybody have a link or know of a good diagram illustrating this for training purposes?
 
Thanks Celtic. :) Is there an article that says the equipotential bonding grid conductor (the #8 solid) has to be continuous? For some reason I was thinking it HAD to be continuous but all it says is a solid #8. Am I missing something somewhere?
 
Honestly Chevy....I don't know ~ I did a pool once about 15 years ago...maybe a pool guru will pop in?

We could look it up...but then there would be no debate :D
 
chevyx92 said:
Thanks Celtic. :) Is there an article that says the equipotential bonding grid conductor (the #8 solid) has to be continuous? For some reason I was thinking it HAD to be continuous but all it says is a solid #8. Am I missing something somewhere?

#8 does not have to be continuous.
 
chevyx92 said:
I thought I saw one time on here a diagram or an article that Mike Holt put out on the proper way to bond pools and pool equipment. Anybody have a link or know of a good diagram illustrating this for training purposes?

chevyx92 said:
Thanks Celtic. :) Is there an article that says the equipotential bonding grid conductor (the #8 solid) has to be continuous? For some reason I was thinking it HAD to be continuous but all it says is a solid #8. Am I missing something somewhere?

Your question about the equipotential bonding grid continuous grounding would be no. . Your original post was very general about bonding pools so an answer about continuous grounding would be yes and no. . It depends on what you're referring to.

Wet-niche Fixture equipment grounding is required to be continuous [680.23(F)(2)] with some exception for certain grounding terminals [680.23(F)(2)(a)+(b)].

The equipotential bonding grid grounding can have wire tie connections on the reinforcing steel ['05 680.26(B)(1), '08 680.26(B)(1)(a)]. . For the connection between steel grid and the copper wire to the motor, '08 says to look at 250.8 [680.26(B)] which gives you a wide open list of everything except a chewing gum splice. . The '08 direction for the 3' perimeter bonding allows "listed splices" ['08 680.26(B)(2)(b)(3)].

Your state probably isn't on the '08 yet but when you get under the '08, don't miss the perimeter bonding of "unpaved surfaces" ['08 680.26(B)(2)]. . Even if it's grass around an aboveground nonconductive pool, you'll need a #8 [680.26(B)(2)(b)(1)] encircling the contour [680.26(B)(2)(b)(2)] 18" to 24" from the pool [680.26(B)(2)(b)(4)] 4" to 6" below finished grade [680.26(B)(2)(b)(5)]. . That's a significant new mandate that never before applied to aboveground pools in the yard.

I'm sure this was more information than you were asking for but it also helps me to run thru this stuff and keep it fresh and clear in mind.

David
 
Hey dnem,
How are you OHIO boys dealing with (680.26c Pool water) on above ground pools. In my area the ladders are plastic.
 
Check out this thread. I'm sure someone will be coming out with something else that can go in line to bond the water that will be a little more above ground friendly in the near future.
 
hey poolboy,
That's a good link to the other tread but anybody that clicks on it should be aware that if they don't read the whole thread, then they'll be confused. . The posts on the first page jumble up the general bond-all-metal requirement of 680.26(B) with the water bonding of 608.26(C). . The water bonding must be in contact with the pool water for 9 square inches. . For the usual plasticlined aboveground pool that can be a challenge to get. . The wet niche fixture counts toward that total but only the underwater section of the metal pool ladder counts. . The usual plasticlined aboveground has no metal underwater light and a plastic ladder. . The motor and the metal in the wall structure doesn't count at all for 680.26(C).

It will be very common for an aboveground to need to add a plate. . Depending on which manufacturer you use, you can get a glue on plate with a lead that comes up over the side but under the top cap, or you can get a bolt thru the side liner and attach the lead wire under a nut head on the outside of the pool.

kram4yoo said:
Hey dnem,
How are you OHIO boys dealing with (680.26c Pool water) on above ground pools. In my area the ladders are plastic.

All depends on which Ohio boy you get. . There's a tremendous amount of ignorance about NEC pool requirements, even among inspectors.

For us that know what we're doing and know what we should be looking for, we're expecting spring to be filled with aboveground pool '08code violations about 2 things:

the perimeter bonding of "unpaved surfaces" ['08 680.26(B)(2)]. . Even if it's grass around an aboveground nonconductive pool, you'll need a #8 [680.26(B)(2)(b)(1)] encircling the contour [680.26(B)(2)(b)(2)] 18" to 24" from the pool [680.26(B)(2)(b)(4)] 4" to 6" below finished grade [680.26(B)(2)(b)(5)]

and the water bonding of 680.26(C) is the second item we expect to see commonly not completed.

David
 
Or, if approved in your area you can just simply use the little gizmo I linked to. To make it even easier you could just stick a stainless or galvanized nipple in the plumbing somewhere and bond to that. In most cased on an above ground pool the plumbing is going to be below the water level.
 
My reaction to anything outside of the pool perimeter would be the same for any device. . 680.26(C), "..... installed in contact with the pool water" would make me question the contact of a device outside of the pool perimeter. . Is there a shut off valve between the body of the pool water and the device ? . I would be looking at it as a concept similar to the continuity concern addressed in 250.53(D)(1).

David
 
pool bonding.What fun!!

pool bonding.What fun!!

dnem said:
My reaction to anything outside of the pool perimeter would be the same for any device. . 680.26(C), "..... installed in contact with the pool water" would make me question the contact of a device outside of the pool perimeter. . Is there a shut off valve between the body of the pool water and the device ? . I would be looking at it as a concept similar to the continuity concern addressed in 250.53(D)(1).

David
Hello all. I got roped in to doing a pool for my parents, sigh and Had a feeling it was going to be a nightmare from the get go and of course it is. It's a in ground metal plate sided with rebar holding them in place, two ladders no light. Doesn't sound bad huh? Well they have a garage with a sub panel in it and I thought that would be great since the pump is going to be behind it I could just grab some power from there easily right? Wrong what I found was a scabbed 3 phase main panel out of IBM and a 3 wire feeder ,sleeved out of a emt coming out of the concrete about a half inch .tight as a banjo string out of the wall to the bottom of the panel with just enough wire to make it in to the panel and to be spliced to even make it to the lugs. Did I mention the wire is some sort of old "SO" or "SJ" :mad: . At that point I wanted to get back in my truck and forget about it, But it's family right. Anyway if that wasn't bad enough I decided to look in the house and see where the feeder was coming from. I found the feeder coming out of the concrete wall , minus a sleeve this time:-? the sleeve was just to get in to the garage hahah, anyway the wire was going to one of the many old screw shell fuse boxes sub panels in this old house, where they thought you had to bond at each panel. Anyway theres a lot more to this nightmare but I don't want to bore everyone with it. I guess my Big question is . Do you need to bring the #8 solid bonding wire up in to the egc feeding the pump outlet? I've seen it a lot on line but not in the 2005. If you know where I may find this article or info I would greatly appreciate it ..Thanks
 
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