Price for service upgrade

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jeff43222

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Minneapolis, Minnesota
I got a call from a guy today asking if I could heavy up a five-plex and a duplex. I told him the five-plex was a little much for me to do by myself, but I could handle the duplex. He asks me about price, and I tell him it would probably be in the $2500-$3000 range. He then tells me he just got off the phone with someone who quoted him a price of $700/unit. I pointed out that it was possible that the other guy lowballed him with the intention of hitting him with expensive charges when he encounters "unexpected" problems. He said he wouldn't fall for that one.

He asked me if my price was firm and if I could work with the $700/unit price, and I told him there's no way I'd do it for that price. I don't see how it's possible to do a service upgrade for that kind of money. The last duplex I did cost me over $1250 just in materials. The last single-family heavy up I did cost me over $700 in materials. That's without any markup. My price for just a standard panel swap is more than $700.

I know labor costs vary from place to place, but I'm curious what other ECs have for material costs for single-family and duplex heavy-ups. The most common situation where I work is overhead service with PVC used as much as possible (everything except masts that have the triplex anchored to them).

[ December 15, 2005, 10:09 PM: Message edited by: jeff43222 ]
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

I'm curious what other ECs have for material costs for single-family and duplex heavy-ups.
Click to expand...
I have never heard the phrase " heavy up " as relating to a service upgrade, but I recall someone posting around $1100.00 for every 100amps of service, which is about what some price books will qoute. That would seem pretty close to me, in my area. But it depends on each ECs pricing.
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

My material for a 100a is about 200-250$. I do service changes for 900$ all the time and make decent money at it. 200A is about 1000-1100, and for the record I would love to charge and make more for my work but I wouldn't get any work. I called a few guys posing as a customer and and some other guys said 650$ and up. :eek:

There was a thread that went on and on about this topic quite a while back try doing a search it was in this forum dept.
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

As a point of reference, the job with the $700+ in materials took me three days, and the final bill was $2000. The customer was so happy that she spread my name far and wide at work (she's in real estate) as someone who does excellent work at a reasonable price, and now I'm getting lots of calls from people who heard about me from her.
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

I am curious what the material list looked like. 3 days?!! I take it a service change in MN is quite different than in MI. I am sure you did a great job just curios of the scope?
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

The job took so long because it was a very old service that had to be moved. I also had to put a new rigid mast through the roof where there was none before, and the roof had a weird soffit made of thick wood planks, with a bonus half-planked section of wood between the soffit and the roof itself that made things difficult. I spent quite a bit of time just dealing with the mast problem.

Inside, the service had to be moved, so all the old circuits (in conduit) had to be dealt with. I had to fashion a couple of large j-boxes and cut holes to match up with the existing conduit. Not exactly something that can be done fast. The homeowner also was adamantly against using the old fuse boxes as j-boxes. She wanted all the old stuff gone.

Basically, it was a pretty big PITA job. Service upgrades go a lot faster when it's basically a panel swap with a meter/mast replacement. I don't get too many like that. Most of the houses I work on were built in the 1920s and 1930s.

For the materials, it wasn't anything out of the ordinary. I had 30' of #1 THHN, 150A QO load center, 200A meter socket, rigid mast, all new breakers, PVC, ground rods, and all the usual paraphernalia. The permit was $80.

[ December 16, 2005, 12:49 AM: Message edited by: jeff43222 ]
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

Jeff,

You're going to get a wide range of prices on this. BTW, as was already mentioned, there was a thread on this some time ago and from what I remember the prices for a 200 amp service ranged from about $1200.00 to $3200.00 depending on where you live and what the market will bear. Prices even vary by counties where I live. In one county the going rate is $1800.00 and just one county over it drops to $1600.00. Material cost in either case is around $500.00 so it becomes a matter of what the installing electrician is willing to make to cover his expenses and make a profit. Obviously, for me, I'd rather work in the higher priced area. When I get a call from other areas my price remains the same. I may get 1 out of 10 jobs, if I'm lucky, and I don't expect more than that.

Bear in mind that there are a lot of guys just starting out in the trade (just like you and I did once) and you're not going to be able to compete with them. There's a learning curve, they'll make mistakes, they'll pay the price, make adjustments for those mistakes and for insurance and for gas in the truck and tools, etc. and finally they'll come up to the level of what we would charge for the same work. But, that takes time and by that time when those newbees come up to our level of experience, the cycle starts all over again.

All I can say is that if you do quality work instead of quantity work your reputation will speak for itself and you'll get your fair share of jobs just by referrals. There's always going to be price shopping customers that will take the lowest possible price. But, like the Kenny Rogers song goes "Know when to hold 'em, Know when to fold 'em, Know when to walk away, Know when to run!"

Phil,
Gold Star Electric
New Jersey
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

A 150 a upgrade (no pipe) around here varies from $500 to $1000. I recently quoted $800 for one and 2 contractors were under that. This is mostly an unlicensed area, handymen can do service upgrades, (some do).
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

I could probably do a service upgrade with SE cable for that price. If the meter was close to the panel, and the panel's branch circuits were wired in NM cable, at 700 bucks I could make a few dollars. I'd NEVER do it, but I could if I wanted to. My material costs don't approach that of the original poster's, and most service upgrades take 2 guys 4-5 hours and never run into days long. Maybe he's working in conduitville.

[ December 16, 2005, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: mdshunk ]
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

In my area of NY we usually wont touch a 100Amp service for les then $1300, a 200amp will start at $2200. For a standard 200amp overhead service cost in parts is $200-$300. New service usually takes about 3hrs and an upgrade about 6hrs, with 2 guys.
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

In NJ along the shore you can expect to pay anywhere between $2,400 and $2,700 for a 200 Amp service upgrade. You won't get every one, but that is in the right ballpark for this area.
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

It sounds like I am indeed in the right ballpark. Every job is different, of course, but since I work almost exclusively in pre-WWII houses, there are more challenges, which is time-consuming.

The three-day job was all conduit, and I was replacing an old multiple-box system that had been cobbled together over the years, so there was hard conduit going in every which direction that I had to connect with. I wound up using a couple of 10"x10" metal boxes that I had to punch holes in for the conduit at just the right places. Material costs were higher because it was a 150A service, and I had to buy a stick of 2" RMC for the mast. Yeah, I could have used something a bit smaller, but I prefer not having to work so hard to cram big wires into small (barely legal) conduit.

In the end, the $2000 150A service upgrade that took three days (working by myself) left a very happy customer. A lot of the work I've been doing lately has been for people who called me after they got my name from her. I try to do good work and leave happy people in my wake. Doing things that way has been a pretty good business strategy; I certainly am not desperate for work by any means. Luckily, I'm in a position where I don't have to take the crummy jobs.

I certainly don't try to compete with the lowballers. That's a sure way to fail. If people want a fixed bid, I give them my best price up front. If they want to grind me on the price, I walk. Jobs like that just aren't worth it.

I figure I must be doing something right; more and more of my business is coming through referrals. Recently I even got a referral from a potential customer I hadn't even met yet. That turned into a good job. She even took me out to eat a couple of times on top of paying me my usual rate. I love the perks of this job. :)
 
Re: Price for service upgrade

speedystevie, what general area are you in?
$2200 starting is WAY high for my area, and I'm only 100 miles north of the city.
Maybe I have to re-think my pricing policy.


Oh, and watch the name plagirism buddy! :D
 
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