Price to draw up plans.

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electrofelon

electrofelon

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Cherry Valley NY, Seattle, WA
I had to draw up plans for a job that required plan review. 13,000 sq feet two story building, 1000A 120/208 service with 6 200 amp mains, 6 200A feeders to branch panels, bunch of roof top AC, mostly just a ton of general use receps but some larger equipment. Included design, one lines, AIC calcs, load calcs, panel schedules, CAD foor plan showing circuits and locations. Cost to do this wasnt discussed (long standing client) and I didnt really keep track of my time. Probably took about a week, maybe a bit less, but I did a few hours here and there. Permit was $1600. Im thinking of charging 3k for this (plus permit cost). Does that sound fair? Too cheap? I bet if they had hired an EE to do it it would have been quite a bit more....
 
The tasks you described sounds like it took a lot more than a few hours.
Being that you are getting profit from doing the install, you don't have to recoup the same profit that an EE would have to when doing the design only.
If it took you 30 hours to do, here and there, and you billed an unloaded rate, would that cover it?
An EE's loaded rate depending on experience might be $150-200/hr
 
ron said:
The tasks you described sounds like it took a lot more than a few hours.
Being that you are getting profit from doing the install, you don't have to recoup the same profit that an EE would have to when doing the design only.
If it took you 30 hours to do, here and there, and you billed an unloaded rate, would that cover it?
An EE's loaded rate depending on experience might be $150-200/hr
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Yeah I should clarify, I meant a work week total, it probably took me 30-40 hours total, but I picked away at it a few hours here and there over several weeks.
 
Thanks for the opinions. I like the design/lite engineering side of it. The hardest part was figuring out some of the software stuff as I am not really set up to make professional plans regularly. I didnt want to redraw the whole floor plan, and I had the plans from the architect, but they were in PDF and the client had a falling out with the architect so I couldnt get the DWG file. My version of Audocad is older and cant import PDFs. I found a free online converter from PDF to DWG that worked perfectly, then I made my receptacle and various other electrical symbols as blocks and pasted them in. Then in the end I had several dozen pages in various formats (pdfs, word, images....) and only the cheap version of adobe reader that wont create, so I found another free online program that merged them all to one pdf and it worked flawlessly. I must have done a good job because I didnt get a single question or correction from the plan reviewer. I can only imagine what some of the plans they get look like 🙃
 
electrofelon said:
Thanks for the opinions. I like the design/lite engineering side of it. The hardest part was figuring out some of the software stuff as I am not really set up to make professional plans regularly. I didnt want to redraw the whole floor plan, and I had the plans from the architect, but they were in PDF and the client had a falling out with the architect so I couldnt get the DWG file. My version of Audocad is older and cant import PDFs. I found a free online converter from PDF to DWG that worked perfectly, then I made my receptacle and various other electrical symbols as blocks and pasted them in. Then in the end I had several dozen pages in various formats (pdfs, word, images....) and only the cheap version of adobe reader that wont create, so I found another free online program that merged them all to one pdf and it worked flawlessly. I must have done a good job because I didnt get a single question or correction from the plan reviewer. I can only imagine what some of the plans they get look like 🙃
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I wish I was sitting next to you, I'd reach over and pat your back. :) Sounds like you did a great job.
 
oldsparky52 said:
I agree the price is reasonable, but I think I'd let the customer know how much time he was paying for.
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I thought about that, but think Ill just go with a fixed price. Its kinda hard to put it into hours, short of just making up something that makes the math come out so that it looks good. There are just a zillion little things that are hard to keep track of, all the thinking, emails back and forth with the gear guy...I guess I could have been like a lawyer and write down every little 5 minute interval!
 
Now give him a coordination study that looks at the Utility's overcurrent protective device and provides adjustments for anything that needs it in the new system. In a system this small it's almost trivial but that depends on the number of adjustable breakers. I suspect there's no ground-fault because it's under 1200 amps, but the 1000-amp trip breaker may have LSI adjustments. If you get all of the data I'd be happy to spend the 20 minutes need to put a TCC together for you. peace. run. eat.
 
mayanees said:
Now give him a coordination study that looks at the Utility's overcurrent protective device and provides adjustments for anything that needs it in the new system. In a system this small it's almost trivial but that depends on the number of adjustable breakers. I suspect there's no ground-fault because it's under 1200 amps, but the 1000-amp trip breaker may have LSI adjustments. If you get all of the data I'd be happy to spend the 20 minutes need to put a TCC together for you. peace. run. eat.
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Wow that is amazing, thank you! I dont think it will be necessary however. There is actually no single main, its a (or it it WILL be rather) MLO panelboard with 6 200's, Siemens HQR2, and I dont know off hand if those have any adjustable trip parameters or not. There is not concern here for selective coordination. The service is interesting: ITs an old square D switchboard, and the permit from 1973 is still right there taped to it. One pole of the main does not open. I contacted Seattle City light and they told me fault current was 111,000 at the transformer spades. I was skeptical, and although I didnt price it out prior, I figured it would behoove me and the client to stay with 65KAIC equipment (even though you can still get a series rating from Siemens' 100kaic 225A or less breakers down to standard 10k branch breakers) so I wen into the vault and took a look (after pumping it out, full of water). Turns out its actually 75k at the transformer secondary, which is under 65 K at the service equipment. Transformers are oddly large, 3x167 kva which is 1390 amps. Dataplate shows mfg date of 1998. I dont know any details of why they were changed then or why they were so big. Might have been some big motors/machines in this place, as there are some weird retrofitted I-beams in various places. Anyway, besides the main breaker with the stuck pole, the distribution breakers are only rated 22k and have no series rating, so that is why that whole thing has to go. It wasnt cost effective to just upgrade the breakers.
 
cdslotz said:
My boss was a PE and he would charge around $150-$200 per sheet....of course that was an "in-house" price as we were also doing the construction.
Don't forget someone has to be paid to stamp the drawings
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So I come in in right about there. This jurisdiction does not require stamped plans. They do have a clause about "clarity of plans" where they can require plans done by an architect or PE if yours are too sloppy/incomplete
 
electrofelon said:
So I come in in right about there. This jurisdiction does not require stamped plans. They do have a clause about "clarity of plans" where they can require plans done by an architect or PE if yours are too sloppy/incomplete
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Are you doing the construction?
 
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