qualified person problems

[wireman1]

in our state there is no requirement to be licensed by the state to
do electrical work. The state is now trying to get a bill through
congress for this requirement. It was tried before and failed.
Because of the economy there are a lot of out of state contractors
doing work in PA, who bring in their own electricians, and if they
need more they hire from temporary agencies. The question is
who determines who is qualified as defined in the NEC. Most likely
the electrical contractor makes that decision. The electrical inspector
has no say in the matter, his only recourse is to do a very thorough
inspection. If he keeps finding numerous violations, and just maybe
the contractor will be more selective with the people he hires. This
situation is very bad and is getting worse.

your comments are welcome and very much appreciated.

 

[petersonra]

in our state there is no requirement to be licensed by the state to
do electrical work. The state is now trying to get a bill through
congress for this requirement. It was tried before and failed.
Because of the economy there are a lot of out of state contractors
doing work in PA, who bring in their own electricians, and if they
need more they hire from temporary agencies. The question is
who determines who is qualified as defined in the NEC. Most likely
the electrical contractor makes that decision. The electrical inspector
has no say in the matter, his only recourse is to do a very thorough
inspection. If he keeps finding numerous violations, and just maybe
the contractor will be more selective with the people he hires. This
situation is very bad and is getting worse.

your comments are welcome and very much appreciated.

the state has the power to pass this kind of thing on its own. no congressional action is required.

licensed is never the same as qualified. they have completely different meanings, and for the most part are not related. it is possible that someone could be both, but someone could also be one or the other, or neither.

it is not the job of an electrical inspector to determine whether a person is qualified or not unless some law says it is.

if a state wants to pass a licensing law to make it harder on out of state contractors to poach your business they can do that. it is well within the power of a state to do that.

if a state wants to enact a licensing law that restricts who can do electrical work in that state the state is well within its powers to do that as well.

 

[jumper]

PA licensing laws are a joke.

MD is barely one step ahead.

IMO every state should be like VA, NJ, MA, NC and others with statewide licensing and a statewide code.

These parochial laws are a bane to our trade

 

[Canton]

PA licensing laws are a joke.

MD is barely one step ahead.

IMO every state should be like VA, NJ, MA, NC and others with statewide licensing and a statewide code.

These parochial laws are a bane to our trade

Totally agree:thumbsup:

In Virginia I have to have (2) Licenses.....a Masters and a Contractors and I can work where ever in the state.

In Maryland...I have a State Master license that is worthless (basically a passport license to get other county licenses).....I have to buy every county license that I wish to work in....some counties have a Masters License and a Contractors license!!!!!!!! Then even worse if I want to work in the state of Maryland and inside one of the counties, and inside a city or municipality I have to buy their ****** License also!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! SO....(get your calculator)....this equals a State Masters, County Masters, County Contractors, and then the City Masters......I have so many licenses to work in Maryland I don't even know what I have anymore!!!!!!!

Ridiculous to say the least......bunch of thieves in the (People's Republic of) Maryland!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[infinity]

in our state there is no requirement to be licensed by the state to
do electrical work.

This is the biggest problem. If there is no state standard to compare to how can you verify anyone as being qualified? Sorry to say but IMO in 2014 any state with no licensing is a joke.

 

[Canton]

This is the biggest problem. If there is no state standard to compare to how can you verify anyone as being qualified? Sorry to say but IMO in 2014 any state with no licensing is a joke.

Amen Brother:thumbsup:

Even with a state standard Master License like Maryland....that has no REAL authority....its still a joke!

They were suppose to eliminate the county level licensing and go with the state in Maryland but nothing happened....its a Cash Cow for the counties!

 

[infinity]

Amen Brother:thumbsup:

Even with a state standard Master License like Maryland....that has no REAL authority....its still a joke!

They were suppose to eliminate the county level licensing and go with the state in Maryland but nothing happened....its a Cash Cow for the counties!

Many states have the local level cash cow problem. Just look at New York State and think about who benefits from having all different types of local licensing with annual fees attached. The surprising thing is how good the system is here in NJ with statewide licensing even though as a State we have a penchant for corruption. :roll:

 

[cadpoint]

The State is not looking out for the welfare of their citizens.

I can't remember where I heard it, maybe in a Code Class, but State wide house insurance rates and over all coverage in any state is to the benefit of the insured and negatively effects coverage to State's without licensing.

It could be any combination of things holding off licensing requirements, the heavy farm base in the State, the prototypical faction of lobby's, even including insurance companies themselves that might have a vested interest in not wanting or seeing a need for licensing.

In a mortgage it's at best, and depending on the value of properties, types, etc. but it comes down to a quarter of a percent to about one percent for insurance value of a property.
(I didn't research the exact numbers, but used these numbers to show that real money is going out over the life of a mortgage loan.)

It seems that in fact the local rural or urban or regional dominion have filled their coffers for years with out any required input from the State of PA.

Sad!

 

[Smart $]

the state has the power to pass this kind of thing on its own. no congressional action is required...

Every state has a legislative body structured quite similar to federal. I know several states have what is referred to as state congress. Not certain about all states.

 

[PetrosA]

I think the problem in PA is that there is a large number of farmers in local and state governments who don't see any need for trade licensing at all, and don't want to pay the increased costs they would have to pay to hire licensed contractors to work on their own farms. In the southeastern part of the state most jurisdictions DO have license requirements, either based on local testing or ICC testing or acceptance of existing licensing from an ICC based jurisdiction. Passing a statewide license requirement could have an immediate and major impact on contractors across most of the state where no licensing is presently required depending on how grandfathering would be applied. It could be a real mess, but one we'll have to deal with at some point.

 

[fmtjfw]

WV

WV

Only the State Fire Marshal can license Electricians. Counties and Cities are forbidden by law from additional (technical) licensing requirements. They have contractor licensing (state and local). In general you must have a WV electrician's license to work in WV. You are allowed to burn your own house down by being unlicensed and doing wiring. Electricians who are employed by Counties (and Cities?) need NOT be licensed.

You are not supposed to be able to wander in from another state and work without a license.

We have Inspector, Master, Journeyman, and Apprentice. There is an assortment of limited licenses as well.

Master and Journeyman can work unsupervised. Up to 3 Apprentices can be supervised by a Master or Journeyman.

Specialty (limited) Licenses:
Electrical Plumbing & HVAC: only wiring directly associated with such and up to but not including CB or fused disconnect installed by Master or Journeyman
Sign Electrician: only wiring directly associated ...
Single-family residential electrician: only single family and aux buildings to same
LV Electrician: fire and burglar alarms
Elevator Electrician: only wiring directly associated ...

Temporary Licenses (once only):

Apprentice: (180 days) completed formal Federally approved App. program or WV approved 1080 hour program
Journeyman: (90 days) completed apprentice as above and 4 years experience -- testing into Union Journeyman Wireman Card does NOT count.
Master: (90 days) completed apprentice as above and 5 years experience including resi, comm and industrial

Reciprocity: (only for those who gained a license through testing)

VA: M & J
OH: M
NC: M
KY: M & J
MD: M
and (horrors) WV Div. of Labor, Contractor's Board: M

 

[Smart $]

...
OH: M
...

Ohio only has contractor licensing, which WV will reciprocate as a Master license.

 

[fmtjfw]

Ohio only has contractor licensing, which WV will reciprocate as a Master license.

Beats me! WV State Fire Marshal site says so. I usually pay almost no attention when the "license lady" comes to speak at the annual 3-day meeting of OH IAEI.

 

[fmtjfw]

Ohio only has contractor licensing, which WV will reciprocate as a Master license.

OK according to the web it is the electrical contractor's license. Odd, since the WV Master's is pure NEC, no business or law covered?

 

[Smart $]

OK according to the web it is the electrical contractor's license. Odd, since the WV Master's is pure NEC, no business or law covered?

Not odd IMO. The non-business part of the Ohio electrical contractor's test is essentially a master electrician test AFAIK.

 

[Fulthrotl]

CA.....

CA.....

all journeymen must have state license to be employed. good statewide.
contractors must have C-10 license, good statewide.

disturbing any pre 1978 residences? EPA RRP cert required.
horrific fines if caught doing work without it.
"work" is disturbing ANY surface.
cutting in a plug? tent it, cupcake.

signage required on work vehicles. makes it easier for them to
hit you up for a business license.

then there is the looming CALCTP-AT debacle. that dead horse
is back there two pages deep in the dead topics....

<-------------

 

[jxofaltrds]

Not odd IMO. The non-business part of the Ohio electrical contractor's test is essentially a master electrician test AFAIK.

It is a commercial (state) license only. No residential licensing or testing required or allowed.

Now an area can register for residential work and require the state license but that is all.

So unless a registration is required anyone can do 1,2,3 family work.

 

[Smart $]

It is a commercial (state) license only. No residential licensing or testing required or allowed.

Now an area can register for residential work and require the state license but that is all.

So unless a registration is required anyone can do 1,2,3 family work.

???

We "were" discussing WV's licensing reciprocity with OH.

 

[fmtjfw]

Not odd IMO. The non-business part of the Ohio electrical contractor's test is essentially a master electrician test AFAIK.

What I found odd is that to pass the Ohio test you have questions on business and law and NEC.
The WV test covers only NEC.
Yet a WV Master I assume can get an Ohio Electrical Contractor license without taking the business and law elements.

 

[GoldDigger]

It is a good bet that reciprocity goes both ways. But not impossible that it is not that straightforward.

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