Re-wire of house that has fuse holder style panel

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sw_ross

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Coppersmith's thread caused me to wonder, but I didn't want to hijack his thread.

Under normal/ideal circumstances, if I were re-wiring an older house that had a fuse box (Main/Range with fuse holders for 120 circuits) that would be the first thing to get ripped out and thrown away!

But that got me wondering, if I was doing a rewire of house that had the walls opened up, where circuits were required to be brought up to current codes is that panel allowed to stay in use?

I know it's not an ideal setup, and I would feel guilty about leaving this setup without upgrading.
Just hypothetical...
 
Coppersmith's thread caused me to wonder, but I didn't want to hijack his thread.

Under normal/ideal circumstances, if I were re-wiring an older house that had a fuse box (Main/Range with fuse holders for 120 circuits) that would be the first thing to get ripped out and thrown away!

But that got me wondering, if I was doing a rewire of house that had the walls opened up, where circuits were required to be brought up to current codes is that panel allowed to stay in use?

I know it's not an ideal setup, and I would feel guilty about leaving this setup without upgrading.
Just hypothetical...

There is really nothing wrong with a fuse box from a safety standpoint, they are mostly bullet proof. Its more a matter of convenience, circuit spaces, and being able to provide AFCI protection.
 
There is really nothing wrong with a fuse box from a safety standpoint, they are mostly bullet proof. Its more a matter of convenience, circuit spaces, and being able to provide AFCI protection.

Nothing wrong with the panel,per se, but HOs would routinely screw in over sized fuses when one blew. The later ones would only accept the correct size, but I would replace for this reason if nothing else.
Here, we have insurance companies starting to not insure homes withe these panels. I had to have my mother in law's replaced last year for this reason.
 
If you're rewiring the house as EF stated you will certainly need some sort of AFCI protection. A new panel will make that easy.
 
I agree with all the above...

If I had to I suppose installing a sub panel that would be used for AFCI circuits would work.
From my perspective it would seem wrong to leave that service unless a person couldn't afford an upgrade, or was maybe budgeting to do the upgrade next year.

For resale purposes I could see a home inspector red flagging that type of panel, making it more challenging to sell.

For insurance sake, I could imagine it affecting costs of insurance, but don't know that for a fact.
 
For insurance sake, I could imagine it affecting costs of insurance, but don't know that for a fact.

Insurance companies generally find out a house has a panel they don't want to insure when the house is sold and the new owner wants to get insurance. A home inspector will certainly bring the subject up during the sale and the buyer would be wise to try to get a discount because of it. If insurance companies can figure out a way to know what panel a house has without a sale, you can be sure they will start dropping policies if owners don't upgrade.

P.S. All of this is good for our business. :D
 
Insurance companies generally find out a house has a panel they don't want to insure when the house is sold and the new owner wants to get insurance. A home inspector will certainly bring the subject up during the sale and the buyer would be wise to try to get a discount because of it. If insurance companies can figure out a way to know what panel a house has without a sale, you can be sure they will start dropping policies if owners don't upgrade.

P.S. All of this is good for our business. :D

Same goes for certain types of plumbing. A guy from State Farm told me that the life expectancy of galvanized water pipe is 75 years. They will not insure an old home with that piping system.
 
Regarding selling/marketing an older house

Regarding selling/marketing an older house

Regarding selling/marketing an older house;

I'm sure each individual case would be different, but it would be interesting to know, on average, what the price difference would be given a house with an old fuse box where the prospective buyer is able to negotiate a lower price vs buying an older house that has a recent service upgrade with current panel.

In other words, for a seller of a house, would the cost of the service changeout (before putting house on market) be less than the "price reduction" that the seller has to accept because they have an old crappy panel?

I would guess that if a seller spent the money upfront to do a basic service changeout, that cost would be less than the reduction in price that the seller would have to accept.

I would imagine if a home inspector looked at a new panel in the basement and was generally impressed he would looked favorably upon the general electrical condition of a home, giving the buyer more confidence to pay a higher price.
 
In other words, for a seller of a house, would the cost of the service changeout (before putting house on market) be less than the "price reduction" that the seller has to accept because they have an old crappy panel?

I would think it depends on the condition of the house being sold and the neighborhood.

If you are selling to someone that's actually going to buy and live in the house then many home improvements can up the selling price. If the house is in a neighborhood where it's probably going to be sold to an investor then home improvements don't go as far to improve selling price.

I have seen homes sell for over a $100K that were just going to be leveled to build a more expensive home. Nothing you could do to these homes would improve the selling price.
 
Regarding selling/marketing an older house;

I'm sure each individual case would be different, but it would be interesting to know, on average, what the price difference would be given a house with an old fuse box where the prospective buyer is able to negotiate a lower price vs buying an older house that has a recent service upgrade with current panel.

In other words, for a seller of a house, would the cost of the service changeout (before putting house on market) be less than the "price reduction" that the seller has to accept because they have an old crappy panel?

I would guess that if a seller spent the money upfront to do a basic service changeout, that cost would be less than the reduction in price that the seller would have to accept.

My experience has been that a real estate agent will call me and ask how much it would cost to change out the panel. The agent then tells the buyers and they reduce the price that much. (Sometime more due to the inconvenience of having to handle it.) BTW, 95% of the time, I won't get that job or any job from that agent. RE agents like to waste your time. That's why I charge RE agents for estimates.

I would imagine if a home inspector looked at a new panel in the basement and was generally impressed he would looked favorably upon the general electrical condition of a home, giving the buyer more confidence to pay a higher price.

Home inspectors look good when they find things wrong. No home inspector wants to say "I didn't find any problems." Impress them all you want, but they are looking for problems. If the HI saw a new panel, he would probably check the permit database to see if it was permitted and inspected.
 
My experience has been that a real estate agent will call me and ask how much it would cost to change out the panel. The agent then tells the buyers and they reduce the price that much. (Sometime more due to the inconvenience of having to handle it.) BTW, 95% of the time, I won't get that job or any job from that agent. RE agents like to waste your time. That's why I charge RE agents for estimates.



Home inspectors look good when they find things wrong. No home inspector wants to say "I didn't find any problems." Impress them all you want, but they are looking for problems. If the HI saw a new panel, he would probably check the permit database to see if it was permitted and inspected.


I share your view of RE agents in general.

But for the home inspectors, I have found that what the inspector finds/writes up depends on who hired him. I have been called into many newly purchased homes which had been inspected and passed by inspectors hired by the RE company. Many times I have told the client to make the RE co or the home inspector pay because the problems were pre-existent and easily seen and ought to have been called. Real estate companies will not re-hire inspectors who call too many things, which sometimes causes them to lose a sale.

On the other hand. the inspectors hired by the buyer (few) usually get everything wrote up, nit picked to death. I have been called in by the seller in those instances to make required repairs. Some are honest calls, actually I would say most are, but some are simply nitpicking. Such as writing up an extension cord running a dryer, which also had a gas outlet which could be used on a gas dryer. I would tell the seller to just unplug the cord and put it away, nothing else needed on that, and other similar things.

So what I am saying is it mostly depends on who hires the home inspector. Anybody buying a home is well advised to hire his own inspector, it will save most of them well over the cost of it.

As for how long galvanized water pipe last in a home, which was brought up in a post above, that depends on the locale in which it is located, determined by both soil conditions and mostly by the hardness or content of the water. I had a home which I had to replace all the galv plumbing at 18 years, and some of the neighbors had to replace theirs sooner. We had hard water. And a side note, in the city of Costa Mesa, or part of it, they had to stop using copper plumbing below ground because the soil was acidic and ate it up. So many things depend on locality.

I have been called out to replace Zinsco main panels because the insurance company would not insure the house with Zinsco in it. But have not been called to replace fused panels ------ ???? And some of the older homes here still have knob and tube wiring in portions of them which nothing is said about. ---- ????
 
I have been called out to replace Zinsco main panels because the insurance company would not insure the house with Zinsco in it. But have not been called to replace fused panels ------ ???? And some of the older homes here still have knob and tube wiring in portions of them which nothing is said about. ---- ????

Correct - in the case of my MIL, we were told to replace the panel, but they did not mention the K&T.
 
A fuse panel would have to have enough spaces in it for all the various required circuits... if it was the case where the house was gutted and rewired
 
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