Recepticle at HVAC disconnects.

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jimalex

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Art 210.63 requires recept's (usually GFIs) not to be installed on the load side of the disconnect. The wording here confuses me since it makes me wonder if tapping the line side is OK. Problems I see there are putting a 20 A recept on a twenty A circuit might lead to nuisance tripping of the supplying breaker, and could you even put a 20 A recept on a larger circuit? I would think you couldn't. Does this requirement point to something I'm missing, or does it really make sure you don't tap the disconnect at all?

Thanks for all info.
 
jimalex said:
Art 210.63 requires recept's (usually GFIs) not to be installed on the load side of the disconnect. The wording here confuses me since it makes me wonder if tapping the line side is OK. Problems I see there are putting a 20 A recept on a twenty A circuit might lead to nuisance tripping of the supplying breaker, and could you even put a 20 A recept on a larger circuit? I would think you couldn't. Does this requirement point to something I'm missing, or does it really make sure you don't tap the disconnect at all?

Thanks for all info.
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I'm sure the intent was not to allow someone to tap a receptacle to the load side of the disconnect because there usually is no grounded conductor available (neutral). only a equipment ground which cannot be used as a neutral.
 
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Usually I pull a 20 AWG hot and neutral in the pipe with the circuits supplying the equipment, adjust pipe and wire sizes accordingly, and nipple off the disconnect to set the GFI. I just wanted to make sure there weren't any circumstances allowing me to use the line side of the disconnect, for say a 40 amp 3 phase circuit, so i wouldn't have to pull a hot wire, which would allow for not derating the conductors since the neutral wouldn't be counted as a current carrying conductor (310.15.B.5.(a) ). I just can't think that a 20 A recepticle on a 40 A circuit breaker is going to be legal. So, I guess, why wouldn't the code just say "don't tap the line or load side of a disconnect for a service outlet"?
 
jimalex said:
Usually I pull a 20 AWG hot and neutral in the pipe with the circuits supplying the equipment, adjust pipe and wire sizes accordingly, and nipple off the disconnect to set the GFI. I just wanted to make sure there weren't any circumstances allowing me to use the line side of the disconnect, for say a 40 amp 3 phase circuit, so i wouldn't have to pull a hot wire, which would allow for not derating the conductors since the neutral wouldn't be counted as a current carrying conductor (310.15.B.5.(a) ). I just can't think that a 20 A recepticle on a 40 A circuit breaker is going to be legal. So, I guess, why wouldn't the code just say "don't tap the line or load side of a disconnect for a service outlet"?
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A 20 amp receptacle installed on a 40 amp circuit is not code compliant, but if I size the feeder to the A/C disconnect correctly for both the A/C unit and the receptacle and follow the feeder tap rules in 240.21(B) I could tap off the line side of the A/C disconnect and supply a receptacle provided that I protect the receptacle with a properly sized OCPD. You would also need to bring in a neutral with the feeder conductors.

Chris
 
I say let the hvac installer install it. It seems they know more than we do, and are telling customers they are allowed to do the electrical portion of the install any how........ At least in my area. Strangly enough, they violate code each time!
 
resistance said:
I say let the hvac installer install it. It seems they know more than we do, and are telling customers they are allowed to do the electrical portion of the install any how........ At least in my area. Strangly enough, they violate code each time!
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Hah! in my experience, EVERYBODY who isn't an electrician thinks they do better electrical work than we do!
 
readydave8 said:
Don't tap the load side because the guy working on the unit may need to plug into recep but have power off the unit while he's working.
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Correct, that is the reason that 210.63 prohibits the receptacle from being connected to the load side of the A/C disconnecting means.

Chris
 
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