I have a question maybe you guys can answer, what would be the requirement for the instructor of a lab where activities will have live power. For example the wiring of a 3 way , and energizing to test. Would the instructor need to be a licensed journeyman? Would the instructor need to have electrical experience to supervise? I'm trying to put together lab procedures. Just want your thoughts.
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- Thread starter Rtssparky
- Start date
rc/retired
Senior Member
- Location
- Bellvue, Colorado
- Occupation
- Master Electrician/Inspector retired
I would say an instructor with real world wiring experience and an electrical license would definitely make the instructor more credible. JMHO
Ron
Ron
Most electrical trades instructors I know have many years of experience, hold contractors and inspector licenses as well as training in vocational instruction. The state has an emergency shut down requirements for these shop areas and usually the receptacles supplying power will have GFCI protection.
zbang
Senior Member
- Location
- Roughly 5346 miles from Earls Court
Experience, yes, but I don't think that work would require any licensing other than maybe a teaching credential. OTOH, I'd very much like them to have a brain and use it, sadly some instructors don't.
TwoBlocked
Senior Member
- Location
- Bradford County, PA
- Occupation
- Industrial Electrician
Consult your insurance company. It's what they do for a living.
Strathead
Senior Member
- Location
- Ocala, Florida, USA
- Occupation
- Electrician/Estimator/Project Manager/Superintendent
I would use a 12V class 2 power source. There is no reason to use exposed 120v to demonstrate the principles.
Thats a good point TwoBlock, I will check into that.
Thats a great point, I will check into that....
Thats a great Idea, Thank you!
kentirwin
Senior Member
- Location
- Norfolk, VA
Per NFPA 70E the instructor would need to be an electrically qualified person to work with exposed parts operating at 50VAC or higher. Required PPE and hazardous voltage boundaries would need to be observed. The 12V idea would be a better course imo.
The first thing I an going to do for lab safety and policies is to first set the requirements of the instructor, that he/she be able to demonstrate abilty as well as have the required certifications, be it a general electricans license or a c-10, both of which require the passing of an exam and require a minimum of 4 years experience working in the field. I am also going to recommend OSHA certification or more specifically, NFPA certification. I appreciate the input on NFPA-70 and will also look into the insurace requirements. Adequate and qualified supervision is an absolute must.
Second part, no live work , all exposed parts 50v and above will need to be enclosed and a barrier present. Proper PPE will be required as well. I will look into implementing 50v or less for hands on training,
Second part, no live work , all exposed parts 50v and above will need to be enclosed and a barrier present. Proper PPE will be required as well. I will look into implementing 50v or less for hands on training,
ruxton.stanislaw
Senior Member
- Location
- Arkansas
- Occupation
- Laboratory Engineer
That is a good idea. If you must use 120 V, running the entire system through a GFCI first doesn't hurt.
Interesting that you picked 50 V. If one used two two 16 V doorbell transformers to simulate a single-phase utility transformer, one would have 32 V hot-to-hot.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Which might not be a bad idea to comply with, but at same time this is not an employment situation so OSHA kind of sort of doesn't apply, though they may try to stick their nose in anyway, particularly should some incident with a death occur.
About 35-40 years ago when I was a student in such labs and live work wasn't as discouraged as is now, we still didn't work in those lab stations while energized, particularly early on in the courses. We would wire things up while not energized, and may later energize it to see if what we did works, usually was after instructor looked things over.
We did have an E stop stations that interrupted power to all lab stations if pressed. I don't know what they have now, that same school has an all new facility built in last 10 years or so and I'm sure there is a lot of differences now in lab from when I went there.
PaulMmn
Senior Member
- Location
- Union, KY, USA
- Occupation
- EIT - Engineer in Training, Lafayette College
...and a master switch in plain view of everyone!
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
Our lab stations had multiple e stop switches located in the lab area, back in late 1980's. IIRC there was a key switch for energizing though and only instructors had keys for it.
ruxton.stanislaw
Senior Member
- Location
- Arkansas
- Occupation
- Laboratory Engineer
The specific requirements for an instructor in a lab with live power can vary depending on your location and the nature of the lab activities. However, here's a general breakdown of what to consider:
Electrical Work vs. Educational Setting:
There's a distinction between performing electrical work and supervising educational activities involving electricity. A licensed journeyman electrician is typically required for tasks that modify existing electrical systems or involve direct electrical installations.
Educational Supervision:
In an educational setting, the focus is on teaching safe practices and electrical concepts. Here's what you might consider for the instructor:
familiarising
Here are some resources that might be helpful:
Electrical Work vs. Educational Setting:
There's a distinction between performing electrical work and supervising educational activities involving electricity. A licensed journeyman electrician is typically required for tasks that modify existing electrical systems or involve direct electrical installations.
Educational Supervision:
In an educational setting, the focus is on teaching safe practices and electrical concepts. Here's what you might consider for the instructor:
familiarising
- Electrical Knowledge and Experience:The instructor should have a strong understanding of electricity, electrical safety principles, and the specific lab equipment involved. This knowledge could be gained through:
- Formal education in electrical engineering or a related field.
- Industry experience working with electrical systems (although a journeyman's license might not be mandatory).
- Completing relevant safety training programs on electrical safety and lab procedures.
- Communication and Instructional Skills: The instructor should be able to effectively communicate electrical concepts and safety procedures to students in a clear and understandable manner.
- Supervision and Safety Emphasis: The instructor should be able to properly supervise students during lab activities, ensuring they follow safety protocols and work within their competency level.
- Lab Procedures and Safety Protocols: Developing clear and well-defined lab procedures is crucial. These procedures should outline step-by-step instructions, safety precautions, and potential hazards associated with the activities.
- Personal Protective Equipment (PPE): Students should be required to wear appropriate PPE, such as safety glasses and gloves, during lab activities.
- Equipment Maintenance: Lab equipment should be regularly inspected and maintained to ensure proper functionality and safety.
Here are some resources that might be helpful:
- National Fire Protection Association (NFPA): The NFPA offers various resources on electrical safety, including their 70E standard for electrical safety in workplaces. https://www.nfpa.org/en
- American Society for Engineering Education (ASEE): ASEE provides resources and recommendations for electrical engineering education, which might be adaptable to a lab setting. https://www.asee.org/