Remote Meter

[Alex electrical student]

I got this situation.

Garage was built 2 years before the house so a 400A meter was installed on the garage that is 250 feet from the house.

So i pulled 2 sets of 4/0 urd triplex from the meter to the house and put 2 disconnects next to each other on the exterior of the house.

Disconnects I used http://www.homedepot.com/p/Square-D...cuit-Breaker-Enclosure-QOM2E2200NRB/100210055


Im in Montana which is (NEC 2014 based) Our state inspector didn't like the disconnects and said he want's to see the meter on the house.

How do i tell him my setup is code compliant? Even if i do the big hassle of moving meter to the house. Even then there would be a problem of having to feed the garage and having to put a disconnect on it.

 

[GoldDigger]

Your basic problem (whether the inspector was thinking of it or not) seems to be that you are either running two sets of feeders to the house or two sets of service wires to the house. Either one would not be code-approved.

Or are you running two URDs from meter to house with one feeding a house panel and the other going back to the garage?

If there is no main disconnect (with fuses or breaker) at the garage, then both URD triplexes are service conductors. If they feed separate panels through separate disconnects you have run two sets of service conductors to the house. Not allowed.

The triplex would also not be acceptable under current codes as a feeder since it does not have separate ground and neutral conductors.

 

[Smart $]

Your basic problem (whether the inspector was thinking of it or not) seems to be that you are either running two sets of feeders to the house or two sets of service wires to the house. Either one would not be code-approved.

Or are you running two URDs from meter to house with one feeding a house panel and the other going back to the garage?

If there is no main disconnect (with fuses or breaker) at the garage, then both URD triplexes are service conductors. If they feed separate panels through separate disconnects you have run two sets of service conductors to the house. Not allowed.

The triplex would also not be acceptable under current codes as a feeder since it does not have separate ground and neutral conductors.

I agree with your assessment if there is a service disconnecting means at the garage and the triplex runs are feeders.

However, if the triplex runs are service conductors and the disconnects are separate enclosures, grouped, and supply separate loads, Code permits one set of service entrance conductors to each enclosure [230.40 Exception No. 2].

 

[Alex electrical student]

Your basic problem (whether the inspector was thinking of it or not) seems to be that you are either running two sets of feeders to the house or two sets of service wires to the house. Either one would not be code-approved.

Or are you running two URDs from meter to house with one feeding a house panel and the other going back to the garage?

If there is no main disconnect (with fuses or breaker) at the garage, then both URD triplexes are service conductors. If they feed separate panels through separate disconnects you have run two sets of service conductors to the house. Not allowed.

The triplex would also not be acceptable under current codes as a feeder since it does not have separate ground and neutral conductors.

what about 230.205(C)

we have done it before on a 25,000 sqft house. You don't want an ugly 800A service with 800A transfer switch and 800A generator slapped onto the side of a 35 Million $ house.

So all the service equipment and generator was installed on the barn that was 300 feet away from the house and it had bunch of feeders going to the 200A panels throught the house.

This house passed the inspection. Had to put a label at the main door telling firefighters where the disconnect is and gave the firefighters a lesson on how to power down the service without disconnecting power to the fire suppression pump for the fire sprinklers.

 

[Alex electrical student]

what about 230.205(C)

we have done it before on a 25,000 sqft house. You don't want an ugly 800A service with 800A transfer switch and 800A generator slapped onto the side of a 35 Million $ house.

So all the service equipment and generator was installed on the barn that was 300 feet away from the house and it had bunch of feeders going to the 200A panels throught the house.

This house passed the inspection. Had to put a label at the main door telling firefighters where the disconnect is and gave the firefighters a lesson on how to power down the service without disconnecting power to the fire suppression pump for the fire sprinklers.

Also 225.31 (E) since we gave documented switching procedures and also trained the local firemen on how to turn on the service it passed.


But in the case i have now. 400a service feeding 2 disconnects on the house that are mounted in one location. Side by side on the exterior of the house. I can easily make documented switching procedure to turn on 2 feeders. Than it would meet the code.

 

[Sierrasparky]

what about 230.205(C)

we have done it before on a 25,000 sqft house. You don't want an ugly 800A service with 800A transfer switch and 800A generator slapped onto the side of a 35 Million $ house.

So all the service equipment and generator was installed on the barn that was 300 feet away from the house and it had bunch of feeders going to the 200A panels throught the house.

This house passed the inspection. Had to put a label at the main door telling firefighters where the disconnect is and gave the firefighters a lesson on how to power down the service without disconnecting power to the fire suppression pump for the fire sprinklers.

What happens with fireman turnover, how is it assured the information is passed along. A firefighter in the middle of the night is going to read a manual. All they want to see is "service disconnect"

 

[Alex electrical student]

What happens with fireman turnover, how is it assured the information is passed along. A firefighter in the middle of the night is going to read a manual. All they want to see is "service disconnect"

All the disconnects are grouped together. So everything is in one location. All the 200A breakers in the I line panel are labled and the 200A Breaker feeding the Fire suppression System is clearly labeled so firemen would NOT turn it off.

The 800A disconnect is clearly labled for fireman not to touch it or else it would turn off Fire suppression system.

So how else would you guys recommend to do it??

 

[Smart $]

what about 230.205(C)...

Unless your service exceeds 1kV, 230.205(C) does not apply. 230.70(A)(3) is the equivalent section for 1000V and less.

 

[Sierrasparky]

All the disconnects are grouped together. So everything is in one location. All the 200A breakers in the I line panel are labled and the 200A Breaker feeding the Fire suppression System is clearly labeled so firemen would NOT turn it off.

The 800A disconnect is clearly labled for fireman not to touch it or else it would turn off Fire suppression system.

So how else would you guys recommend to do it??

Your statement says that there are 200 amp panels throughout the house. I don't see how this is grouped. Is there a main group of disconnects on the side of the house that will shut off the house. What I am getting at the disco are 300 feet away in a barn.

 

[Smart $]

All the disconnects are grouped together. So everything is in one location. All the 200A breakers in the I line panel are labled and the 200A Breaker feeding the Fire suppression System is clearly labeled so firemen would NOT turn it off.

The 800A disconnect is clearly labled for fireman not to touch it or else it would turn off Fire suppression system.

So how else would you guys recommend to do it??

Which service and disconnects are we talking about?

Seems you are talking about two different different services. Please clarify OP scenario nd stay on topic. If you want to discuss a different service, start another thread.

 

[Alex electrical student]

Your statement says that there are 200 amp panels throughout the house. I don't see how this is grouped. Is there a main group of disconnects on the side of the house that will shut off the house. What I am getting at the disco are 300 feet away in a barn.

No disconnects on the house. Just a remote control by the main door that would talk to the breakers in the service at the Barn.

 

[kwired]

No disconnects on the house. Just a remote control by the main door that would talk to the breakers in the service at the Barn.

You don't have service conductors at the house so no service disconnecting means is required at the house.

However 225.31 still requires a disconnecting means for all conductors that supply or pass through the separate structure, and 225.32 requires it to be in or on the builiding supplied and near the point of entry of conductors if inside - very similar to service disconnecting means requirements.