Replacing an existing panel

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Vinniem

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Central Jersey
Due to customer concern, I am planning to changing out an existing federal pacific 100 amp breaker panel (residential)with 100 amp Square D breaker panel.

The service will not be touched.
Branch circuits will not change.

All I'm doing is changing the panel. I have not been able to contact the AHJ yet to get his feelings on it.

Do I have to update anything or is it ok the way it is?
 
I asked an AHJ the same question last week. He said even though he cant enforce it (rehab code) he wanted to see the grounds updated. When I picked up the permit he had written "inspect as a new service" on it.
 
Here, the POCO wants you to change the meter also. which means a whole new service. The jaws do get old/worn.


Admitedly, I HAVE changed out the panels only and updated the bonding/grounding if the service conductors and meter socket look ok
 
panel upgrades here are required to meet current code.. includes meter and grounding..even wants the bedrooms afci'ed and the kitchens and bathrooms on gfci when it is fesable..:confused:
 
I agree with the others on the grounding issue. But, when you stop and think about it, once you do that the only thing left is to replace the meter pan and service cable. Why not just do it up front. You may think that you're doing your customer a favor but in reality you're not really doing them a service by not upgrading the entire service. It's kind of like getting an oil change and not changing the filter.

Just my opinion.

I just had a service call yesterday where the customer told me that their breaker panel had been sparking for over 2 years. When I got there I found that one half of their main breaker had burnt up. I had the POCO out to unlock the meter and I replaced the main breaker. I got 3 miles down the road when the customer called me and said their power was out again. I went back, pulled the meter only to find out that one of the lugs had heated up and loosened and each time you plugged the meter back into the socket it would break the contact and not feed through.

I could have replaced the breaker panel only but it would have back-fired on me when I found out that the meter pan needed to be replaced. I managed to wedge a screw into the meter lug (temporarily) to aid it in making contact but this house needs a new service (including a mast) and I won't be able to do it until the spring. That's what they get for waiting two years !!!
 
Goldstar....next a splice on the OH lateral will fail. :D

All my recent service ups have all failed in the same way....at some point upstream of the POA/cut-in.
 
celtic said:
....next a splice on the OH lateral will fail.
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You're probably right but at that point it's not my problem - it's POCO's. I'm trying to avoid doing a service upgrade (with a mast) in the winter. While I've done them in tha past in emergency situations (with ice and snow) they're just not fun.
 
Here's how NOT to do it.

DSC01279.jpg
 
220/221 said:
Here's how NOT to do it.

DSC01279.jpg
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How did that mess pass inspection???? Fused and unfused in the same trough! Not a wp trough! open KO in the top! No neutral in the panel! MC outside! and then some.
 
Cavie said:
How did that mess pass inspection???? Fused and unfused in the same trough! Not a wp trough! open KO in the top! No neutral in the panel! MC outside! and then some.
Click to expand...

How 'bout bonding bushings?

Neither panel or gutter look 3R to me.

Where are the ground electrodes?

What size, and where, is the neutral?

And NO MAIN!
 
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How did that mess pass inspection???? Fused and unfused in the same trough! Not a wp trough! open KO in the top! No neutral in the panel! MC outside! and then some.
Click to expand...


InSPECTION?....I don't think so. No grounding, no bonding.

The "trough" is actually the original service with the bus removed.. The neutrals are still landed in there with a #12 jumper going to the new panel..Almost ALL of the panels installed here in AZ until the late 1960's were not raintight. Some of them are installed sideways :) I change them out all the time.

This clown figured he was upgrading I guess. Believe it or not, it is nowhere near the worst I've come across in my years. I JUST recently started taking pics though. Good stuff.
 
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480sparky said:
And NO MAIN!
Click to expand...
There's no need; you can de-energize the service with six throws of the hand:

1) Cut meter seal

2) Remove seal and discard

3) Unscrew band screw

4) Remove meter band

5) Grasp meter firmly

6) Pull meter from base
 
goldstar said:
I agree with the others on the grounding issue. But, when you stop and think about it, once you do that the only thing left is to replace the meter pan and service cable. Why not just do it up front. You may think that you're doing your customer a favor but in reality you're not really doing them a service by not upgrading the entire service. It's kind of like getting an oil change and not changing the filter.

Just my opinion.

I just had a service call yesterday where the customer told me that their breaker panel had been sparking for over 2 years. When I got there I found that one half of their main breaker had burnt up. I had the POCO out to unlock the meter and I replaced the main breaker. I got 3 miles down the road when the customer called me and said their power was out again. I went back, pulled the meter only to find out that one of the lugs had heated up and loosened and each time you plugged the meter back into the socket it would break the contact and not feed through.

I could have replaced the breaker panel only but it would have back-fired on me when I found out that the meter pan needed to be replaced. I managed to wedge a screw into the meter lug (temporarily) to aid it in making contact but this house needs a new service (including a mast) and I won't be able to do it until the spring. That's what they get for waiting two years !!!
Click to expand...

Do you guys really call it a "meter pan" or do you have an accent?
 
jrannis said:
Do you guys really call it a "meter pan" or do you have an accent?
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I love it. That has been driving me nuts since I started on this forum. I've called it "Metercan" for over 30 years. When I see meter pan, I sometimes stop and have to think about what we are talking about.
 
jrannis said:
Do you guys really call it a "meter pan" or do you have an accent?
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Yes, us "Joisey" boys do have an accent but it doesn't necessarily pertain to metering equipment. I don't know why we refer to a meter housing or cabinet up here as a "pan". I'm guessing "pan" is short for panel (we take short-cuts on everything - even speech). What would "can" be short for ? Cannister ? Whatever the case, as long as they know what I'm talking about at the supply house I really don't care what we call it as long as I get the right thing delivered. As it is I have 3 major POCO's in my area. Two require a fifth jaw at 9:00 and the other doesn't. I hate getting the wrong stuff delivered to the jobsite.
 
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