Can anyone provide any information on the requirements for the use of spark-proof tools in a Class 1 Div. 1 area? I have been searching for over a week and have been sent in circles with no direct answer.I need to ensure that the maintenance personnel are ok to work in these areas with out having to use brass tools for eveything. If someone could point me to the standard or publication for this I would appreciate any help as soon as possible because we are in the process of buying brass tools for all our mechanics because of this.
Requirement for spark-proof tools in Class 1 Div. 1
- Thread starter lhutto
- Start date
- Status
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
I know my fellow moderator, Robert, who is an expert in classified areas does not agree with this, but I have a problem with people being permitted to work in Class I, Division 1 areas from a health and safety aspect. For many flammable products you have an IDLH (Immediately Dangerous to Life and Health) at about 10% of LEL (lower explosive limit). How can we say that for the purposes of the electrical installation, we have to assume that we can be at or above LEL, but yet send workers into that area without supplied air respriators and other PPE for the IDLH atmosphere? If we have to use non sparking tools, because of the chance a standard tool will cause a fire or explosion, how can any one even be permitted to work in the area?
We do wear respirators in the rooms I am speaking of. We are not over the limits for an 8 hour period, but it was more of a safety caution. The areas contain Naptha & VM&P for the area of concern. We currentlyuse intrinsically safe equipment and only pneumatic powered tools. But someone brought up that we shoudl also be using brass for maintenance work and I didn't think that was correct. If there was such a concern about the explosion possibility the pump sprockets and anything else that you could potentially "drop" would all have to be brass. So looking at it from that point I dont' think it's necesaary to use brass wrenches and tools, but I want to be sure.
billsnuff
Senior Member
- Location
- East of 480sparky
tools at the link FWIW
tools at the link FWIW
http://www.csunitec.com/nonsparking/nonsparking.html
This is what we use for normalpropylalcohol and methylacetate in drums
tools at the link FWIW
http://www.csunitec.com/nonsparking/nonsparking.html
This is what we use for normalpropylalcohol and methylacetate in drums
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Given the fairly low LEL...0.6%, I think I would want to use non-sparking tools if I was working there.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
I don't know about the hazardous areas you work in Don but the few I have worked in all required a hot work permit to do just about anything. That included me sitting in front of a computer screen.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
For what it's worth, I do agree with you about the health and safety issues and I believe I acknowledged it some time ago. I also think I even "analyzed" a location a while back on the forums with that thought in mind. The basic issue I had was, in absence of general "area classification" rather than "electrical area classification" standards, electrical area classification documents should not be used for anything but selection of electrical equipment and installations.
In several EU countries ?area classification? is actually the norm; and the area classification documents are used to determine fire-proofing, mechanical equipment separations, piping insulation and several other design elements, as well as electrical. This is reflected in the various ?Zone? certifications for the tools billsnuff?s post linked to. It?s been a while since I have investigated it, but I don?t believe they deal with the health and safety concerns either.
It may well be worth it to contact the NFPA Standards Counsel and suggest to that such a general area classification Standard be created, including health and safety aspects.
- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
Bob,
I think the last part of the quote above is where I still have a problem. I understand the electrical classification system is not intended to work the way I want it to, but we have a system in place that tells us for the purposes of the electrical installation we have to assume that the atmosphere is within the flammable range, but we don't have to make the same assumption when we send people into the area!!
Maybe the real issue is one that we have talked about before...the areas that are over classified.
- Location
- Mission Viejo, CA
- Occupation
- Professional Electrical Engineer
Gee - we're fighting hard to agree with each other here
. Because I definitely think we're getting closer on the issue.I have fewer problems with using electrical area classification for other purposes than you may think and especially with Division 1 locations. However, my experience has been, when it is used beyond the purposes originally "intended" I've seen pressure (often very extreme pressure) to change the proper area classification to avoid an inconvenient consequence caused by the extended use. However, the problem is far more common with Division 2 locations.
One of the most common examples is roads. Some clients absolutely refuse to believe its ok to drive through a Division 2 area and insist they have sufficiently trained hydrocarbon molecules that the boundary automatically stops at a curb or edge of the road. I had a nightmare on one project where a client used the electrical area classification to determine the facility?s fireproofing.
I agree over-classification is a genuine problem. The Zone method had the potential to alleviate some of it ? until the US version force-fit it to match Divisions.
My basic position is, if you use electrical area classification for some other purpose than it was intended, fine ? but don?t ask me to change it when it becomes inconvenient.
Cold Fusion
Senior Member
- Location
- way north
I can't give any information on requirements/regulation. I don't even know that there are any regulations - other than OSHA general duty clause - and that may not apply to you.
However, here is the philosophy that I have been working to for the last 40 years - a lot of that time iin so called hot areas, such as av-gas tank yards. I would never depend on non-sparking tools to keep an atmosphere close to the LEL from igniting. I could not send anyone into an atmosphere above 10% LEL. Some places I have worked set the %LEL limit at any reading at all.
Working in a C1D1 area is not particularly dangerous. Working in an area suceptable to flammable vapors and not monitoring is foolhearty and will eventually clean the gene pool.
So what do you do to reduce the risk to a low level? There are excellent %LEL meters (sniffers) on the market that can be calibrated to the exact chemical you are dealing with. Keep the atmosphere out of the explosive range. Either be way below the LEL, or way above the UEL. If you have to get in the area, turn on the ventilation, don't go in until the atmosphere sniffs clean. Use a calibrated meter.
The biggest issue I have with non-sparking tools is the message they send, "It's okay to go into a flammable atmosphere, you have non-sparking tools. Nothing will happen." Anything goes wrong, anything at all, a tiny static spark, you can't get away from it - the air is on fire. And if somehow you survive the heat without burning your lungs to a crisp, you are not going to survive the lack of oxygen.
Get the meters. Get the calibration equipment. Get the ventilation. Sniff the area as you go in. If the process is ongoing, continuously monitor. If the %LEL starts up, set the tools down and get out. Don't go back until it is clear.
People have been doing this work safely for a lot of years - but it is all predicated on keeping the atmosphere well below the LEL - not on using copper-beryllium tools.
Side Note: c-b is a lot better than brass and they look really neat. I have a couple of hammers - expensive suckers.:grin:
cf
Last edited:
- Status