highkvoltage
Senior Member
When in the NEC are placement and wiring methods explained? or is this NFPA standard explained elsewhere as in the building code?
Residential smoke detectors
- Thread starter highkvoltage
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ryan_618
Senior Member
- Location
- Salt Lake City, Utah
Re: Residential smoke detectors
In the applicible building code and the NFPA 72.
In the applicible building code and the NFPA 72.
peter d
Senior Member
- Location
- New England
Re: Residential smoke detectors
To expand on what Ryan said, generally speaking, the location and placement of smoke detectors is found in local codes and NFPA 72.
The wiring methods are covered in the NEC. For instance, in a typical residence, we use NM cable and plastic boxes for the smoke detectors. Nothing unusual there.
However, if we are talking about a fire alarm system, then I must consult the local codes, because they far exceed the NEC. The entire system must be done in metal raceway.
To expand on what Ryan said, generally speaking, the location and placement of smoke detectors is found in local codes and NFPA 72.
The wiring methods are covered in the NEC. For instance, in a typical residence, we use NM cable and plastic boxes for the smoke detectors. Nothing unusual there.
However, if we are talking about a fire alarm system, then I must consult the local codes, because they far exceed the NEC. The entire system must be done in metal raceway.
highkvoltage
Senior Member
Re: Residential smoke detectors
I was looking for the sections relating to residential placement.(Bedrooms, hallways and basement.) I was told that they are all on the same circuit that come from the master bedroom and are wired so that if any of them go to alarm they all do and that if power is lost in the master bedroom they will all sound/show (LED bliking) an alarm. That one of them must be a combination smoke/CO2 detector usually the one in the hallway. I do not do alot of residential work so what better place to ask. Also can you buy a copy of the NFPA 72 and if so what is the cost?
I was looking for the sections relating to residential placement.(Bedrooms, hallways and basement.) I was told that they are all on the same circuit that come from the master bedroom and are wired so that if any of them go to alarm they all do and that if power is lost in the master bedroom they will all sound/show (LED bliking) an alarm. That one of them must be a combination smoke/CO2 detector usually the one in the hallway. I do not do alot of residential work so what better place to ask. Also can you buy a copy of the NFPA 72 and if so what is the cost?
rcarroll
Senior Member
- Location
- Fort Collins, Colorado
Re: Residential smoke detectors
'97 UBC sec. 310.9.1.4 or '03 IRC SEC. 313 will tell you the locations. They are not required to be on any particular circuit other than have AFCI protection per NEC 210.12. CO detectors are not in any code unless a local code. They are required to be wired so if 1 goes off, they all go off. I always ran a 14/3 between them. I hope this helps. Ron
'97 UBC sec. 310.9.1.4 or '03 IRC SEC. 313 will tell you the locations. They are not required to be on any particular circuit other than have AFCI protection per NEC 210.12. CO detectors are not in any code unless a local code. They are required to be wired so if 1 goes off, they all go off. I always ran a 14/3 between them. I hope this helps. Ron
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Re: Residential smoke detectors
HKV, if you just want the locations, they're usually:
1 inside each bedroom (and other rooms with closets which can be considered as bedrooms).
1 between the bedroom 'area' and the rest of the house, sometimes a second for, say, a T-shaped hall.
1 minimum on each floor, sometimes more for large floors; check the detector instructions.
Ask the AHJ about attic and basement spaces; note: some detectors don't work well in hot attics.
I'd add a compatible carbon-monoxide detector for fuel-burning appliances: gas/oil furnace, etc.
HKV, if you just want the locations, they're usually:
1 inside each bedroom (and other rooms with closets which can be considered as bedrooms).
1 between the bedroom 'area' and the rest of the house, sometimes a second for, say, a T-shaped hall.
1 minimum on each floor, sometimes more for large floors; check the detector instructions.
Ask the AHJ about attic and basement spaces; note: some detectors don't work well in hot attics.
I'd add a compatible carbon-monoxide detector for fuel-burning appliances: gas/oil furnace, etc.
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
Re: Residential smoke detectors
Additionally, it's a good idea to place them on a lighting circuit you'll notice if it trips. However, I just did a large house with a dozen, and gave them their own 15-amp circuit.
Additionally, it's a good idea to place them on a lighting circuit you'll notice if it trips. However, I just did a large house with a dozen, and gave them their own 15-amp circuit.
nedard2004
Member
Re: Residential smoke detectors
1 in each bedroom and one in the hallway outside of each bedroom, along with one in the basement. All units are interconnected and have battery backup. When bedroom doors are shut and persons are sleeping, this will allow for the units to sound througout. Furthermore, we install the smoke detectors not less than 24" from the bedroom wall to avoid dead spots where smoke may not travel to. Also, we install units as far away from the bathroom as possible and at least 10 feat away from the furnace and water heater...to avoid any nuissance tripping. Still searching for a way to interconnect attic heat detectors rated for 190 degrees or higher.
1 in each bedroom and one in the hallway outside of each bedroom, along with one in the basement. All units are interconnected and have battery backup. When bedroom doors are shut and persons are sleeping, this will allow for the units to sound througout. Furthermore, we install the smoke detectors not less than 24" from the bedroom wall to avoid dead spots where smoke may not travel to. Also, we install units as far away from the bathroom as possible and at least 10 feat away from the furnace and water heater...to avoid any nuissance tripping. Still searching for a way to interconnect attic heat detectors rated for 190 degrees or higher.
Re: Residential smoke detectors
LarryFine and nedard2004 have the right idea. The best place to go for applicable local requirements is the AHJ. The detectors that go off when any others go off just have a 3rd wire to signal the other smokes. Once you've fed the first one you should run a 3 wire cable the rest of the way to accomplish this. I have provided a link for the reference you were asking about sometimes you can get the stuff cheaper on amazon.com though.
http://www.nfpa.org/catalog/product.asp?pid=72HB02&target%5Fpid=72HB02&src%5Fpid=7299&link%5Ftype=up%5Fsell&src=nfpa
LarryFine and nedard2004 have the right idea. The best place to go for applicable local requirements is the AHJ. The detectors that go off when any others go off just have a 3rd wire to signal the other smokes. Once you've fed the first one you should run a 3 wire cable the rest of the way to accomplish this. I have provided a link for the reference you were asking about sometimes you can get the stuff cheaper on amazon.com though.
http://www.nfpa.org/catalog/product.asp?pid=72HB02&target%5Fpid=72HB02&src%5Fpid=7299&link%5Ftype=up%5Fsell&src=nfpa
Re: Residential smoke detectors
Never understood the use of CO/smoke detector combinations. Smoke rises, naturally. However, CO is a heavy gas and will seek out low areas, such as the floor and basement stairwells. My thinking is by the time there is a enough CO to trigger the alarm, there is probably more than sufficient CO to cause death. I try to avoid istalling the combination alarms for this reasoning. Smokes belong onthe ceiling (or upper portion of the wall), and the CO's belong near the floor.
Never understood the use of CO/smoke detector combinations. Smoke rises, naturally. However, CO is a heavy gas and will seek out low areas, such as the floor and basement stairwells. My thinking is by the time there is a enough CO to trigger the alarm, there is probably more than sufficient CO to cause death. I try to avoid istalling the combination alarms for this reasoning. Smokes belong onthe ceiling (or upper portion of the wall), and the CO's belong near the floor.
allenwayne
Senior Member
Re: Residential smoke detectors
One in each bedroom and one within 10 ft of a bedroom door,but not within 3 ft, of forced air duct and also not within 3 ft measured horiz. of a bath room door.
one at top of a 2 story home and another at the botom of said stairs (also within 10 ft)If cathedraled ceiling one within 1 ft of higest point but also within 3 ft of that peak.
If I am wrong pleae correct me since this is what i haveour crews do to over 2,000 homes a year
:roll:
One in each bedroom and one within 10 ft of a bedroom door,but not within 3 ft, of forced air duct and also not within 3 ft measured horiz. of a bath room door.
one at top of a 2 story home and another at the botom of said stairs (also within 10 ft)If cathedraled ceiling one within 1 ft of higest point but also within 3 ft of that peak.
If I am wrong pleae correct me since this is what i haveour crews do to over 2,000 homes a year
:roll:
pierre
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
Re: Residential smoke detectors
In NY State:
Residential Building Code
"R317.1 Single-and multiple-station smoke alarms. Single-and multiple-station smoke alarms shall be located in the following locations.
1. In each sleeping room.
2. Outside of each separate sleeping area in the immediate vicinity of the bedrooms.
3. On each additional story of the dwelling, including basements and cellars but not including crawl spaces and uninhabitable attics. In dwellings or dwelling units with split levels and without an intervening door between the adjacent levels, a smoke alarm installed on the upper level shall suffice for the adjacent lower level provided that the lower level is less than on full story below the upper level.
When more than one smoke alarm is required to be installed within an individual dwelling unit the alarm devices shall be interconnected in such a manner that the actuation of one alarm will activate all of the alarms in the individual unit. The alarm shall be clearly audible in all bedrooms over backround noise levels with all intervening doors closed.
All smoke alarms shall be listed and installed in accordance with the provisions of this code and the household fire warning equipment provisions of NFPA 72.
For locations in NFPA 72 : (for more specific requirements)
11.5.1 One-and Two-Family Dwelling Units.
Notice the lack of a requirement to install smoke alarms in BOILER ROOMS, and they are NOT required in unfinished attics.
And of course follow the specific installation instructions from the manufacturer - read the instructions that come with the smoke alarm, as they have a lot of very good information - and are easy to read
In NY State:
Residential Building Code
"R317.1 Single-and multiple-station smoke alarms. Single-and multiple-station smoke alarms shall be located in the following locations.
1. In each sleeping room.
2. Outside of each separate sleeping area in the immediate vicinity of the bedrooms.
3. On each additional story of the dwelling, including basements and cellars but not including crawl spaces and uninhabitable attics. In dwellings or dwelling units with split levels and without an intervening door between the adjacent levels, a smoke alarm installed on the upper level shall suffice for the adjacent lower level provided that the lower level is less than on full story below the upper level.
When more than one smoke alarm is required to be installed within an individual dwelling unit the alarm devices shall be interconnected in such a manner that the actuation of one alarm will activate all of the alarms in the individual unit. The alarm shall be clearly audible in all bedrooms over backround noise levels with all intervening doors closed.
All smoke alarms shall be listed and installed in accordance with the provisions of this code and the household fire warning equipment provisions of NFPA 72.
For locations in NFPA 72 : (for more specific requirements)
11.5.1 One-and Two-Family Dwelling Units.
Notice the lack of a requirement to install smoke alarms in BOILER ROOMS, and they are NOT required in unfinished attics.
And of course follow the specific installation instructions from the manufacturer - read the instructions that come with the smoke alarm, as they have a lot of very good information - and are easy to read
Re: Residential smoke detectors
it is a shame to put smokies on gfci or afci.
if code requires it you have to do it.
i am sure i am going to bring a huge controversy again! but, my feeling is the gfci or afci that MAY save your life, may also kill you! when it has nusiance tripped and no one payed attention on the smoke branch.
also, carbon monoxide detectors should not be more than 4 feet off the floor! preferably lower. if you read the specs on the stand alone units thats what they reccomend. so why then do they have combo ceiling units? same senosr. hmm.
and... some systems are low voltage after the first unit and do not require a raceway even in illinois. most systems the third wire(interconnect) is low voltage and does not require a raceway. anunciator systems do require all emt.
if it is my home, i want to minimize any possibility of the branch going out of service(tripped ocpd). and i want all metal raceways. a fire will burn those conductors right up and maybe only one dector goes off. not required everywhere but nice idea. one last thing, never put the smokies on a recept branch! beleive me ive seen this. plug in vacuum trip it, smokies on battery, chirp ignored, fire, disastor!
ron g.
it is a shame to put smokies on gfci or afci.
if code requires it you have to do it.
i am sure i am going to bring a huge controversy again! but, my feeling is the gfci or afci that MAY save your life, may also kill you! when it has nusiance tripped and no one payed attention on the smoke branch.
also, carbon monoxide detectors should not be more than 4 feet off the floor! preferably lower. if you read the specs on the stand alone units thats what they reccomend. so why then do they have combo ceiling units? same senosr. hmm.
and... some systems are low voltage after the first unit and do not require a raceway even in illinois. most systems the third wire(interconnect) is low voltage and does not require a raceway. anunciator systems do require all emt.
if it is my home, i want to minimize any possibility of the branch going out of service(tripped ocpd). and i want all metal raceways. a fire will burn those conductors right up and maybe only one dector goes off. not required everywhere but nice idea. one last thing, never put the smokies on a recept branch! beleive me ive seen this. plug in vacuum trip it, smokies on battery, chirp ignored, fire, disastor!
ron g.
Re: Residential smoke detectors
my mistake. i threw in gfci with afci.
it is strange that hospitals do not permit afci OR gfci on life sustaining equipment here yet.
maybe as seiing the original skepticisim over them and then millions being recalled?
i'd like to think smokies are life sustaining equipment! nonetheless if code requires an afci i do what code says. they usually go on the mb (celing)lights which is on afci since it is a bedroom.
my mistake. i threw in gfci with afci.
it is strange that hospitals do not permit afci OR gfci on life sustaining equipment here yet.
maybe as seiing the original skepticisim over them and then millions being recalled?
i'd like to think smokies are life sustaining equipment! nonetheless if code requires an afci i do what code says. they usually go on the mb (celing)lights which is on afci since it is a bedroom.
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