RGS for GE

[LRB]

If a wire EGC is pulled with CCC, for feeder to separte structure, can the RGS be utlized as a grounding electrode? If not code section forbiding please.

 

[iwire]

If a wire EGC is pulled with CCC, for feeder to separte structure, can the RGS be utlized as a grounding electrode? If not code section forbiding please.

No.


See 250.52(A)(1) through 250.52(A)(8). Those sections describe the allowed electrodes and a horizontal buried RGS is not one of them.

Drive two ground rods and get it done.

 

[Smart $]

On a very strange day, in a neighborhood far, far from here, you may be able to use a metal conduit as a GE. Only where you encounter rock bottom driving an 8ft. rod or pipe electrode at 45° would you permitted to use a conduit buried in a trench not less than 30in. deep. See 250.52(A)(5)(a) and 250.53(G).

 

[iwire]

On a very strange day, in a neighborhood far, far from here, you may be able to use a metal conduit as a GE. Only where you encounter rock bottom driving an 8ft. rod or pipe electrode at 45° would you permitted to use a conduit buried in a trench not less than 30in. deep. See 250.52(A)(5)(a) and 250.53(G).

You are absolutely correct in what it says.

Good luck getting an inspector to accept that would apply to a conduit containing a feeder or branch circuit and before you point out the code does not say that, I know and I still maintain it wont fly.

 

[Smart $]

You are absolutely correct in what it says.

Good luck getting an inspector to accept that would apply to a conduit containing a feeder or branch circuit and before you point out the code does not say that, I know and I still maintain it wont fly.

I'd just like to hear about anyone making attempt to get it off the ground, regardless of the outcome. :happyyes:

 

[petersonra]

If a wire EGC is pulled with CCC, for feeder to separte structure, can the RGS be utlized as a grounding electrode? If not code section forbiding please.

The code allows pipe type electrodes. It does not allow for conduit to be used as an electrode.

Having said that, it is a stupid distinction but that is what the code actually says. It also says the pipe type electrode would have to be driven in most cases.

 

[Smart $]

The code allows pipe type electrodes. It does not allow for conduit to be used as an electrode.

Having said that, it is a stupid distinction but that is what the code actually says. It also says the pipe type electrode would have to be driven in most cases.

I beg to differ...

(5) Rod and Pipe Electrodes. Rod and pipe electrodes
shall not be less than 2.44 m (8 ft) in length and shall
consist of the following materials.

(a) Grounding electrodes of pipe or conduit shall not
be smaller than metric designator 21 (trade size 3⁄4) and,
where of steel, shall have the outer surface galvanized or
otherwise metal-coated for corrosion protection.

(b) Rod-type grounding electrodes of stainless steel
and copper or zinc coated steel shall be at least 15.87 mm
(5⁄8 in.) in diameter, unless listed.

 

[kwired]

I beg to differ...

I agree it seems to be allowed to be used as an electrode under 250.52(A)(5). If not then it would at least fit under (A)(8).

 

[LRB]

Thank U all for the responses. So that all can rest peacefully, the feeder is already installed and ground rods driven. I utilized the conduit for the EGC, with a bonding bushing. As I was hooking up the bonding jumper to the bonding bushing I thought that I was essentially making the conduit a third electrode as well as an EGC, thus I thought I would post this thread for discussion
. Actually Petersonra got me thinking about this in the following post
“petersonra
Senior Member
Join Date
Aug 2004
Location
Northern illinois
Posts
14,287
By any chance does the underground EMT qualify as a grounding electrode?
Bob”

He did not get an answer. However in my post he states the code does not allow conduit to be used as GE, to which he was corrected by Smart and Kwired. No one has convinced me such an install would not be code complient, however it would “never fly” but would be “well grounded"

 

[Smart $]

... No one has convinced me such an install would not be code complient...

You won't get any argument from me as long as it is at least 3/4" conduit, at least 8ft. buried, and one point is at least 8ft. underground.


I'm curious...

If I have a conduit running just under a basement slab, in otherwise undisturbed soil, and where the basement slab is at least 8ft. below grade, does this meet the depth of 8ft. requirement?

PS: May have to nudge it a tad with a hammer so it qualifies as "driven".

 

[iwire]

No one has convinced me such an install would not be code complient,

I did not try, I agree with smarts points and posts as far as what the code says.

I just know in my area it would be a fight and the least costly and quickest way to move on to the next job would be to drive two rods and pass inspection.