Rough in before Dry in

[InspectorPatches]

I have a building being erected and we were asked to what extent of wiring can be done before walls are installed that we would be ok with. They proposed using MC for the in wall wiring and that they usually get approved to do that as long as they stay 10ft from the exterior wall until official dry in can be achieved. My question is this, since MC is not rated for wet or damp locations without a jacket around, is that something other inspectors see and are ok with or what is the industry standard when it comes to rough in wiring before dry in?

 

[Rick 0920]

Depends on your AHJ. When I was wiring houses, an inspector stopped by because he was "in the neighborhood" while I was working. It was raining heavily and the roof was dried-in but the house had no windows installed. He told me that he wouldn't pass a rough-in unless I removed a lot of the NM cable near window openings. I've had others that it didn't bother them one bit if the structure wasn't 100% dry. If you have to get in now for scheduling purposes, talk to your inspector and go by what he says.

 

[Ohm2]

As it relates to electrical that is required to be installed in dry locations I would not install anything until the interior is protected from water(). Check with the AHJ.

 

[infinity]

According to the Article 100 definition a dry location can be subjected to weather conditions that may cause dampness or wetness during construction so the structure would not be required to be entirely closed in to install wiring methods that are only permitted in dry locations.

Location, Dry.
A location not normally subject to dampness or wetness. A location classified as dry may be temporarily subject to dampness or wetness, as in the case of a building under construction.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Location, Dry. (Dry Location)
A location not normally subject to dampness or wetness. A location classified as dry may be temporarily subject to dampness or wetness, as in the case of a building under construction. (CMP-1)

 

[Ohm2]

Location, Dry. (Dry Location)
A location not normally subject to dampness or wetness. A location classified as dry may be temporarily subject to dampness or wetness, as in the case of a building under construction. (CMP-1)

Then we can refer to 110.3(B)

 

[infinity]

Then we can refer to 110.3(B)

Meaning? Normally dry wiring methods are permitted to get wet or damp during building construction.

 

[jim dungar]

... Normally dry wiring methods are permitted to get wet or damp during building construction.

If not, how would you be able to unload your truck when it is raining?

 

[Ohm2]

Meaning? Normally dry wiring methods are permitted to get wet or damp during building construction.

Example: I believe a 4 square metal box ( 181) is only tested for up to NEMA 1 location. I believe this means it is meant to be for indoor dry locations only. So per manufacturer rules this specific box isn’t allowed to be installed in any environment that it hasn’t been tested for. I should add: in the real world we know things may get wet. Temporary needs to be defined as it relates to how long

 

[roger]

Example: I believe a 4 square metal box ( 181) is only tested for up to NEMA 1 location. I believe this means it is meant to be for indoor dry locations only. So per manufacturer rules this specific box isn’t allowed to be installed in any environment that it hasn’t been tested for.

Unless the listing instructions specifically say it can not be wet during construction it can per the definition of "Location, Dry"

You can look into the UL white book and post substantiation to your claims.

 

[Ohm2]

Unless the listing instructions specifically say it can not be wet during construction it can per the definition of "Location, Dry"

You can look into the UL white book and post substantiation to your claims.

My point: do not wire a structure if the structure is not dried in. Obviously we will have moments where things may not be as intended. We roughed-in homes with open windows and partially unprotected roofs on a few occasions.

 

[roger]

My point: do not wire a structure if the structure is not dried in.

Unfortunately schedules don't always allow that.

 

[Little Bill]

We have one inspector that won't let you rough-in until windows are in. Then he wants something covering doors, such as plywood or plastic.
Others will allow just roof and walls, doors and windows are not addressed.

 

[Ohm2]

We have one inspector that won't let you rough-in until windows are in. Then he wants something covering doors, such as plywood or plastic.
Others will allow just roof and walls, doors and windows are not addressed.

Very true!!!

 

[infinity]

My point: do not wire a structure if the structure is not dried in. Obviously we will have moments where things may not be as intended. We roughed-in homes with open windows and partially unprotected roofs on a few occasions.

If you do high rise construction a 60 story building would take 10 years if you had to wait for the entire thing to be closed in. The bottom floors are being fit out before the building is even topped out. Water will always find it's way in during construction which is why the definition for dry locations includes temporary wetness as being allowed during construction. It's just the nature of how it gets done and what harm will come to a galvanized 1900 box if it gets a little wet?

 

[Ohm2]

If you do high rise construction a 60 story building would take 10 years if you had to wait for the entire thing to be closed in. The bottom floors are being fit out before the building is even topped out. Water will always find its way in during construction which is why the definition for dry locations includes temporary wetness as being allowed during construction. It's just the nature of how it gets done and what harm will come to a galvanized 1900 box if it gets a little wet?

Read my post above

 

[LarryFine]

According to the Article 100 definition a dry location can be subjected to weather conditions that may cause dampness or wetness during construction so the structure would not be required to be entirely closed in to install wiring methods that are only permitted in dry locations.

Location, Dry.
A location not normally subject to dampness or wetness. A location classified as dry may be temporarily subject to dampness or wetness, as in the case of a building under construction.

Yes, but is that actually a permission to do it, or is it more of a warning to avoid doing it?

 

[infinity]

Yes, but is that actually a permission to do it, or is it more of a warning to avoid doing it?

It's part of the definition so that something listed for dry locations can be installed during the construction of a building even if there is a chance that it may get wet during the construction.

 

[Fred B]

Location, Dry. (Dry Location)
A location not normally subject to dampness or wetness. A location classified as dry may be temporarily subject to dampness or wetness, as in the case of a building under construction. (CMP-1)

Meaning? Normally dry wiring methods are permitted to get wet or damp during building construction.

While the definition seems to indicated that wiring before completely dried in can be done real world conditions can be otherwise. Had one, a log structure, that had wiring that some of it was still exposed before enclosing. The NM from the open end had wicked water almost 5ft uphill and total distance up the cable of 20ft.

 

[roger]

Yes, but is that actually a permission to do it, or is it more of a warning to avoid doing it?

It is the CMP realizing that there is some leeway to any definition. The definition is what it is, it is not allowing dry wiring methods to be exposed to wet conditions for long term. Do it and don't look back, it will be fine.