Seimens GFI

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Dennis Alwon

Dennis Alwon

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Retired Electrical Contractor
Just curious if anyone else has had an issue. I installed a gfci made by seimens today and the breaker worked for a short time and tripped. Went to reset it and I couldn't reset it. Took it out and disconnected everything and it still wouldn't reset.

So a short trip to the supply house and got another..Lucky for me I took it out of the box and sure enough it wouldn't flip to the on position, tried another-- same thing. We went thru 8 breakers before we found one that held. I hope it holds....

I have no idea how many of them are bad but I was curious if anyone else has had that issue

I only use Seimens when the existing panel is a Seimens panel. This was the first gfci breaker for this brand I have used in years.
 
Any chance that some versions of that part number (mixed bag of versions on the supply house shelf?) will not reset without power applied? Self-test or similar design?
 
I have never seen a gfci that would not set unless power was applied. We thought the same thing but then we fou.nd some that actually set.....The handle would just spring back with no engagement.

Unless Seimens changed their product and there were some old and new ones I think they have a bad batch, especially since the original one I used failed the same way with and without power
 
Could there be a transport latch

Could there be a transport latch

Dennis Alwon said:
Just curious if anyone else has had an issue. I installed a gfci made by seimens today and the breaker worked for a short time and tripped. Went to reset it and I couldn't reset it. Took it out and disconnected everything and it still wouldn't reset.

So a short trip to the supply house and got another..Lucky for me I took it out of the box and sure enough it wouldn't flip to the on position, tried another-- same thing. We went thru 8 breakers before we found one that held. I hope it holds....

I have no idea how many of them are bad but I was curious if anyone else has had that issue

I only use Seimens when the existing panel is a Seimens panel. This was the first gfci breaker for this brand I have used in years.
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Breakers are locked in 'Open' position to prevent damage during transport.
We are supposed to remove this latch before installing the breaker.
Could it be some thing similar with the GFCI too!!
 
These are not fakes and I don't deny Seimens makes good stuff but it looks like they have a defective batch. Most of the ones we tried would not hold while some of the others did so that is pretty clear to me. Right out of the box-- it won't engage.

I have had this issue with Cutler Hammer and Ge in the past but not every one in the group. One here, one there is understandable but this is a factory mess up IMO.
 
It seems to be you got a hold of the latest version of GFCI breaker that will not set unless it’s installed with power at the buss. As the new ones use a holding circuit as a fail safe for the self test feature. You can definatly feel a difference in the way it sets when moving the handle to ON. It starts out with some resistance as usual then a split second after you make full travel there is a click that holds it in the ON position.
 
mopowr steve said:
It seems to be you got a hold of the latest version of GFCI breaker that will not set unless it’s installed with power at the buss. As the new ones use a holding circuit as a fail safe for the self test feature. You can definatly feel a difference in the way it sets when moving the handle to ON. It starts out with some resistance as usual then a split second after you make full travel there is a click that holds it in the ON position.
Click to expand...

There is absolutely no resistance at all when you try to turn it on. It is like a flipper on game table- pull it and let it go. I think there would need more than that to operate correctly
Do you know for certain that the new seimen gfci need power to have the handle stay in the closed position.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Uh Oh the spelling police are here. For some reason I thought it was spelled "ei" not "ie"
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With Siemens being a German company I always have to check to make sure I spell it right because I'm not sure that any of our "English" rules for spelling would really apply.
 
For the German vowel pairs ie and ei, the pronunciation rule is that they sound close to the long English vowel that is the second letter of the pair.

Cheers, Wayne
 
i was trying to make a non spelling point.
supply chains sometimes get gray market stuff, and in some cases from what i have seen, colors & logos & fit may appear ok but they used wrong spelling (example not from electrical gear).

that said, carry-on.


i bet ya, take this to your crew and show them the wrong name, they'll identify it as the Siemens brand we all know ;)

Color-_Siemens-_Logo.jpg
 
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My supplier is a Siemens distributor. I doubt they got fake stuff from Siemens and I am pretty sure they would not buy off market stuff like that. They have 5 or so stores in NC and I doubt they would risk their reputation on that. I have dealt with this supplier for over 35 years
 
Dennis Alwon said:
My supplier is a Siemens distributor. I doubt they got fake stuff from Siemens and I am pretty sure they would not buy off market stuff like that. They have 5 or so stores in NC and I doubt they would risk their reputation on that. I have dealt with this supplier for over 35 years
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distribution is in the supply chain ;)
they wouldnt know they were getting gray stuff unless they have a good active program to test & validate what they get. not all do that.

example, a big reputable Cisco distributor i worked with in the past,....... was selling gray market stuff, they just didnt know they were. but in these cases the spelling and colors and stuff was all good, but the internals were not.

and sure, "grey market" is really something different than supply chain compromised with re-productions, but many times the supply chain gets a swap-in from gray market w/o the destination folks knowing about it.
 
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FionaZuppa said:
distribution is in the supply chain ;)
they wouldnt know they were getting gray stuff unless they have a good active program to test & validate what they get. not all do that.

example, a big reputable Cisco distributor i worked with in the past,....... was selling gray market stuff, they just didnt know they were. but in these cases the spelling and colors and stuff was all good, but the internals were not.

and sure, "grey market" is really something different than supply chain compromised with re-productions, but many times the supply chain gets a swap-in from gray market w/o the destination folks knowing about it.
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If supply house is purchasing directly from the manufacturer then you presumably don't get gray stuff. If there are other "middle men" then you might have some concerns.
 
kwired said:
If supply house is purchasing directly from the manufacturer then you presumably don't get gray stuff. If there are other "middle men" then you might have some concerns.
Click to expand...

"supply house", or is it "distribution"

even a supply house who buys direct from a US company who makes the crud in China is at risk, because the stuff doesnt magically transfer like Willy Wonker movie. it has to be loaded onto trucks, moved on ships, passed through ports, etc etc etc.

obviously its less risky if everything is facilitated in the US, but just about everything in electrical industry is made outside the US.
 
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