service disconnect switch

[Ken 6789]

On a house with 200 amp service there would be a service disc. sw. on the outside and the main panel (mlo) will be installed approx. 25' away inside. I am curious on how most electricians wire in the gec. Should the gec be terminated to the disc. sw or the panel that is 25' away. Is it ok to run the grd rod and h20 to the main panel only and none to the disc. or split one to the panel and other to the disc. or run all the gec's to the disc. and run an egc from there to the panel inside? If I run all the gec's to the disc. I know not to bond the ground and neutral in the panel. Also, I would have to get a small ground bar in the disc. and attach the h2o, grd rod gec's, egc to the panel, and a short jumper to the smaller terminal off the neutral lug in the disc. Again, just curious how most contractors terminate the gec's with a disc.

 

[220/221]

GEC and pipe bond wires to the disconnect switch.

 

[Ken 6789]

ok, suppose if the panel is near the main h20 line, can the egc double as a gec? thanks

 

[220/221]

edit. I think I misunderstood.



I assume that the water bond has to be seperate but don't know for sure.

Someone elase?

 

[Ken 6789]

I suppose it's ok to bond the grd/neu on the panel as long as you run the h2o gec to it and grd rod gec connected to the neu lug in the disc. Anyone agree with this?

 

[e57]

Anyone agree with this?

Not really I got lost..... You have a service disconnect with no OCP outside, and another panel with OCP inside?

Neutral bond MBJ would be in whatever enclosure the GEC is in. Usually the service disconnect, and usually with OCP.... Normally they are one in the same...

230.91 Location.
The service overcurrent device shall be an integral part of the service disconnecting means or shall be located immediately adjacent thereto.

Anyway I do it in the service disconnect and usually on only one full sized conductor all in a line - doesn't matter at that point what is first, and only one conductor to mess with in the panel.

 

[haskindm]

If I understand you correctly the Main Service Disconnect is outside. This makes the Distribution Panel located 25 feet away what is commonly referred to as a sub-panel. The ground/neutral connection and the grounding electrode connection must be made at the Service Disconnect - see 250.24(A)(1). If the waterline is being used as a grounding electrode, this connection must also be made at the service disconnect. If you are just bonding the waterline 250.104(A) indicates that this bond should also be located in the service equipment enclosure which would be the outside disconnect as I understand your situation. You will need to make sure that the disconnect is suitable for use as service equipment. You will also need to install a grounding conductor from the disconnect to the distribution panel and keep the grounds and neutrals separated in the distribution panel.

 

[celtic]

So instead of this:

You want it to be like this:

....

 

[haskindm]

Either way is correct according to the NEC. The ground/neutral connection and the grounding electrode conductor connection cannot be AFTER the service disconnect. They may be ahead of it, such as in the meter base, if the POCO allows it.

 

[220/221]

I thought that the GEC had to be continuous to both ground rods?

The drawing shows two clamps/wires.

Was I mis informed?

 

[sawdust454]

I thought that the GEC had to be continuous to both ground rods?

The drawing shows two clamps/wires.

Was I mis informed?

220/221
Has to be continous to the first rod, a seperate clamp is allowable to connect the supplemental rod.
Ron

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I thought that the GEC had to be continuous to both ground rods?

The drawing shows two clamps/wires.

Was I mis informed?

You were misinformed however many EC still believe it needs to be continuous. I still install the GEC continuous to both rods. It's one clamp less and not hard to do.

 

[Ken 6789]

Not really I got lost..... You have a service disconnect with no OCP outside, and another panel with OCP inside?


I forgot to mention that the service disconnect switch has 200 amp breaker inside. panel inside are MLO's

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Not really I got lost..... You have a service disconnect with no OCP outside, and another panel with OCP inside?


I forgot to mention that the service disconnect switch has 200 amp breaker inside.

That does not change the fact that you would need to bond to the main disco. Haskindm has stated it correctly in post 7

 

[celtic]

Here are some shots of a recent service upgrade's GEC:

 

[Ken 6789]

I have seen an installation, either this wasn't inspected properly by the AHJ or the ec cut corners, but there was a 200 amp disc w/ ocp and a panel with mlo's about 25' inside of the house in the basement. The grond rod was attached to the disc outside and a egc was ran from the disc inside to the panel. The egc and neutral are separate here in the panel (not bonded). Instead of the ec running the h2o gec to the disc. he ran it to the egc grounding bar inside of the panel. I was wondering if the egc can double as a gec back to the disc. I believe this is a violation, but I just wanted to confirm it. Thanks for all the replies everyone!

 

[220/221]

Haskindm has stated it correctly in post 7

Ahem......what about post TWO?


Thanks for the info on the continuous GEC. I generally do them together unless I am adding one or have an oops moment.

 

[augie47]

Post 2 ??

Post 2 ??

Ahem......what about post TWO?

.

a. not near lenghty enough
b. no pictures
c. no mention of 30 years experience
d. not argumentative

therefore, does not meet mininum Forum requirements:grin:

 

[celtic]

For a thread to have ANY credibility...it MUST contain pictures and links.
If the link turns up 404, all the better