Service Entrance Cables

[finster1]

Ok guys, the posts around here have some of you guys saying SE is not allowed in raceway for service entrance conductors but I check 2005/2008 and cant find any thing prohibiting for the above ground. In the newest code they updated the article 338 to include 338.12 uses not permitted and still for the service entrance mast I dont find anything prohibiting.....Any thoughts. I use XHHW al but it is not as readily available as SE so before I consider using the SE I wanted the consensus of you guys...........I like the look and protection of the conduit on the vertical above ground service conductors and in todays economy everyone else likes saving money so I can pass it on.

Customers today seem to want the most bang for there buck and they dont necessarily want the electricians feeling on copper over aluminum. So I say give them what they want and lower the cost. We can let them choose and charge accordingly. Aluminum installed correctly is just as good and cheaper and wire at Home Depot and Lowes in our area of New Jersey beats the heck out of our supply houses...

 

[peter d]

No, we said that USE is not allowed to be used above ground except for the portion that is in the riser to the meter socket. Technically, this would also disallow it for use that would terminate at a pole riser because that portion is above ground and subject to sunlight where it attaches to the poco drop. It seems to me the only place you can use USE that is not rated as sunlight resistant is strictly underground use only.

As to your concern, the supply houses in my area carry the dual rated USE. It doesn't matter what Lowes or HD charges or carries - you need to use the correct wire for the job.

 

[finster1]

So this dual rated USE can be used in the riser from the pan to the service drop?

 

[peter d]

So this dual rated USE can be used in the riser from the pan to the service drop?

Yes, as long as it's marked "sunlight resistant" it can be used.

 

[augie47]

An associated problem with SE cables in conduit comes from Table 9 Note 9 in that you have to treat it as a single conductor and base the fill in the cable's greatest cross sectional dimension. This will require a larger conduit than required with individual conductors.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

An associated problem with SE cables in conduit comes from Table 9 Note 9 in that you have to treat it as a single conductor and base the fill in the cable's greatest cross sectional dimension. This will require a larger conduit than required with individual conductors.

To add to what Gus says, you can't run se cable in conduit underground.

Let's not mix se and USE. They are different animals. I believe I stated in the last thread on this that if it were dual rated you could run it in conduit.

 

[Alwayslearningelec]

What is the difference between USE & SE....I know what they stand for. Thanks.

 

[cpal]

What is the difference between USE & SE....I know what they stand for. Thanks.

338.12 Uses Not Permitted.
(A) Service-Entrance Cable. Service-entrance cable (SE) shall not be used under the following conditions or in the following locations:
(1) Where subject to physical damage unless protected in accordance with 230.50(A)
(2) Underground with or without a raceway
(3) For exterior branch circuits and feeder wiring unless the installation complies with the provisions of Part I of Article 225 and is supported in accordance with 334.30 or is used as messenger-supported wiring as permitted in Part II of Article 396
(B) Underground Service-Entrance Cable. Underground service-entrance cable (USE) shall not be used under the following conditions or in the following locations:
(1) For interior wiring
(2) For aboveground installations except where USE cable emerges from the ground and is terminated in an enclosure at an outdoor location and the cable is protected in accordance with 300.5(D)
(3) As aerial cable unless it is a multiconductor cable identified for use aboveground and installed as messenger-supported wiring in accordance with 225.10 and Part II of

 

[Dennis Alwon]

What is the difference between USE & SE....I know what they stand for. Thanks.

They are both used for service entrance. The USE is for underground. The SE cable is for above ground interior or exterior. The SE cable has a jacket as IN SEU and SER cables. USE is insulated conductors suitable for direct burial.