service grounding

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kmc

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I am installing a new 200 amp service that requires a nema 3r disco that then runs about 50 feet to the service panel. There are existing ground rods near the service panel (50 ft away from the disco) and I was wondering if I could run only three service entrance conductors (2 hots and nuetral in pvc) from the nema 3r disco to the service panel and then ground the grounded conductor at the service panel (not the first means of disconnect) to save on wire costs and installing new ground rods. Thanks in advance for any input.
 
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so I quess there is no other way around running a #4 ground wire that 50 feet or so from the first means of disconnect to the service panel? Can I still use the existing ground rods 50 feet away via the service panel or is would this be a bad idea?
 
I'd compare the cost and labor of running the 50' of wire to the cost and labor of new rods. Personally, I'd want the rods close to the disconnect. By the way, rods alone only require #6.
 
#6 copper is ok to use if connecting only to ground rods. If you are required to have 2 ground rods, make sure they are at least 6' apart from each other. You can also drive ground rods below the disco.
 
Forgive my ignorance, this is the first time I have had to install a disco for a residential service panel. Most of my experience is industrial. But wont I still need to ground the service panel via a grounding conductor to the disco and based on the 200 amp service that will require a #4 conductor? I know from the panel/disco to the ground rod only a #6 wire is required.
 
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I assume that this a remodel & you are relocating & upgrading the service, correct? If so, install the 200a disco, bond your neuts/ground rods, water pipe, if necessary. Then run a 4/0 al SER cable to the remote panel. The grounding wire from the disco to the remote panel becomes an equipment grounding conductor & needs only to be a #6 cu. However, using the ser cable, the egc will be a part of the cable. Hope this helps.
 
Cool, thanks again. The 2" pvc conduit is already run and I will just add a #6 grounding conductor, cheaper than a #4. You helped heaps.
 
It helps to understand the concepts if you train yourself to use the correct terminology. What you are referring to as the disco., is now the main service disconnect. It will need to be labeled as suitable for service. What you are referring to is the service is now a distribution panel. You will need to separate the grounds and neutrals in the distribution panel as they are only brought together in the service. You will need to run a separate equipment grounding conductor with the feeder to the distribution panel. The Grounding electrode conductor will be brought to the service e1quipment (now the disconnect).
 
If the disconnect on the pole is your service disconnect,and you don't have any metallic paths between the pole and the house, why can't you use 250.32(B)2. Install your rods at the pole,and then connect to your grounded conductor to the electrodes at the building.
Rick
 
georgestolz said:
Ditto Rick's comment, I'm confused.
I've never run an EGC from a remote service to a structure. I've always employed 250.32(B)(2).
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We are all confused because the OP doesn't say whether the disco is on the building or on a pole away from the building. We are assuming on a pole away from the building but I am not sure that is the case. Any help here KMA.
 
Sure, glad to help. Sorry for the confusion. The customer wants me to move the existing meter can away from their back deck to the side of the house and to upgrade the service to 200 amps. The new meter can and service disconnect will be on the side of the house 50 ft away from the distribution panel. This is the same structure and I do not believe that 250.32 (B)2 will apply. This house is very long (over 100ft), but only has a basement in the middle of the home, where the distribtion panel is currently located, not a typical install. Thanks you all for your input.
 
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