JohnE
Senior Member
- Location
- Milford, MA
I believe that there is no requirement to use arc fault breakers when performing a service upgrade or panel change in MA. Would anyone like to agree or disagree?
The reason I post this is because I had a conversation with a continuing ed. provider today who has already taught one 15 hour course on the 2008 code and has told the class that if you change a service in MA you are required to use arc faults on any circuits which would now require them.
I called him to try to explain that I didn't think that was the case.
He felt that MA Rule 3 (which says) "Additions or modifications to an existing installation shall be made in accordance with this Code without bringing the remaining part of the installation into compliance with the requirements of this Code. The installation shall not create a violation of this Code, nor shall it increase the magnitude of an existing violation." would require the use of arc faults.
I feel that Rule 3 is what allows you do a service upgrade without bringing the remaining portion up to code.
We had a lengthy discussion, and he said he is going to call me tonight when he can get home and review the rules and his notes.
There was a lot discussed, including the very short lived MA amendement in '02 which was a new section 210.12(C) which stated "Overcurrent Device Replacements: Where panelboards are replace that contain one or more circuits requiring AFCI protection by one or other sections of the Code, AFCI protection shall be provided for such circuits." Again this amendment only lived for around a month or so beginning in January 2002. At some point in the first half of '02, the requirement above was dropped from the MA Amendments. Please forgive me for the bold text, but I didn't want to confuse this issue by mentioning the requirement in blue above, without trying to be completely clear that this is not required now. I thought that including it might explain for some of the confusion, though.
I expect that he will call me tonight and agree with me. If that is the case, I just wanted to put out this thread for anyone else to read. There is apparantly a lot of confusion here in MA, because at the office, we are getting a lot of calls asking if AFCI's are needed for a service change. We couldn't understand why there was so much confusion. According to some callers, other inspectors are requiring the AFI's on an upgrade.
And if I am somehow looking at this wrong, I wanted the input from others here.
And for what it is worth, this is a very knowledgeable provider. I have taken his classes in the past and have a lot of respect for him. And this was a friendly conversation. I am not trying to show him up by posting on here. Just looking for some input.
Thanks,
John
The reason I post this is because I had a conversation with a continuing ed. provider today who has already taught one 15 hour course on the 2008 code and has told the class that if you change a service in MA you are required to use arc faults on any circuits which would now require them.
I called him to try to explain that I didn't think that was the case.
He felt that MA Rule 3 (which says) "Additions or modifications to an existing installation shall be made in accordance with this Code without bringing the remaining part of the installation into compliance with the requirements of this Code. The installation shall not create a violation of this Code, nor shall it increase the magnitude of an existing violation." would require the use of arc faults.
I feel that Rule 3 is what allows you do a service upgrade without bringing the remaining portion up to code.
We had a lengthy discussion, and he said he is going to call me tonight when he can get home and review the rules and his notes.
There was a lot discussed, including the very short lived MA amendement in '02 which was a new section 210.12(C) which stated "Overcurrent Device Replacements: Where panelboards are replace that contain one or more circuits requiring AFCI protection by one or other sections of the Code, AFCI protection shall be provided for such circuits." Again this amendment only lived for around a month or so beginning in January 2002. At some point in the first half of '02, the requirement above was dropped from the MA Amendments. Please forgive me for the bold text, but I didn't want to confuse this issue by mentioning the requirement in blue above, without trying to be completely clear that this is not required now. I thought that including it might explain for some of the confusion, though.
I expect that he will call me tonight and agree with me. If that is the case, I just wanted to put out this thread for anyone else to read. There is apparantly a lot of confusion here in MA, because at the office, we are getting a lot of calls asking if AFCI's are needed for a service change. We couldn't understand why there was so much confusion. According to some callers, other inspectors are requiring the AFI's on an upgrade.
And if I am somehow looking at this wrong, I wanted the input from others here.
And for what it is worth, this is a very knowledgeable provider. I have taken his classes in the past and have a lot of respect for him. And this was a friendly conversation. I am not trying to show him up by posting on here. Just looking for some input.
Thanks,
John
